Over pressure.

FDA_Approved · 10-25-2012, 05:35 AM

Dear, FF. No one likes it. So gay.

Even trailer doesn't like playing against that shit.

Raynian · 10-25-2012, 06:10 AM

Please get rid of this homosexual bullshit.

Nobody likes being stopped dead after they pass the HW, or having a HW poke out behind a wall and your run is fucked.

Give the HW caltrops as his secondary fire. Temporarily places a few around him, 30 second cooldown.

Or just leave him with nothing since he's fine as is.

Trailer · 10-25-2012, 07:42 AM

I <3 overpressure. Threads like this make me <3 overpressure even more.

caesium · 10-25-2012, 10:05 AM

<3 well argued points.. but i gotta agree, imo overpressure's ghey - hate playing with it and hate playing against it.

caesium · 10-25-2012, 10:16 AM

how about an "adrenaline overdose" that greatly increases your rate of fire (~2/3x?) but then after x seconds (~10/15?) you explode into gibs (cos your heart explodes ofc). obviously there'd be some clear onscreen effect like increasingly bulging veins in your god forsaken dying eyes.

FDA_Approved · 10-25-2012, 03:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Trailer

I <3 overpressure. Threads like this make me <3 overpressure even more.

He's lying don't you listen to that shit. He admited to me, it's hella gay.

Dr. eXpl0si0n · 10-25-2012, 05:17 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by caesium

how about an "adrenaline overdose" that greatly increases your rate of fire (~2/3x?) but then after x seconds (~10/15?) you explode into gibs (cos your heart explodes ofc). obviously there'd be some clear onscreen effect like increasingly bulging veins in your god forsaken dying eyes.

ROFL I love that idea please do it!!!!!!!!

Trailer · 10-25-2012, 05:17 PM

It's only gay when I'm not the HW. =D

moosh · 10-25-2012, 05:48 PM

I say give the HWG teleporters.

Snipe · 10-25-2012, 05:52 PM

OMFG I CANT RUN IN A DIRECT STRAIGHT LINE TO THE BUTTON/FLAG CAUSE THERES AN HW AND HE WILL OVERPRESSURE ME AND FUCK UP MY SPEED!!!!!!!1!!!1!! END OF WORLD!!!!!! OMG THEN I GOTTA START ALL THE WAY BACK AT MY RESPAWN AND TAKE ANOTHER 10 FUCKIN SECONDS TO GET BACK TO THE SAME SPOT!!!!!!!!!!!

lol you guys are silly. I rarely play HW, but when I do I enjoy using it. Keeps scouts and spies on their toes. While playing AGAINST an HW, I just stay the hell away from them. Which is what I did before overpressure was ever implemented.

NeonLight · 10-25-2012, 05:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snipe

OMFG I CANT RUN IN A DIRECT STRAIGHT LINE TO THE BUTTON/FLAG CAUSE THERES AN HW AND HE WILL OVERPRESSURE ME AND FUCK UP MY SPEED!!!!!!!1!!!1!! END OF WORLD!!!!!! OMG THEN I GOTTA START ALL THE WAY BACK AT MY RESPAWN AND TAKE ANOTHER 10 FUCKIN SECONDS TO GET BACK TO THE SAME SPOT!!!!!!!!!!!

lol you guys are silly. I rarely play HW, but when I do I enjoy using it. Keeps scouts and spies on their toes. While playing AGAINST an HW, I just stay the hell away from them. Which is what I did before overpressure was ever implemented.

It's not really Overpressure that's the issue, it's the current code for it where you can be PAST the heavy and it will slightshot you backwards if you get hit by it.

KubeDawg · 10-25-2012, 06:09 PM

When the OP radius is so big that it completely blocks some areas in their entirety, that's a problem for me. At most, this should be an add-on to the Assault Cannon to have a cone-based fire that has the same effects as the current OP, but it requires the HW to estimate where the enemy is concing towards.

Overpressure was a good name for this feature as OP is also short for OVERPOWERED.

XPelargos · 10-25-2012, 06:21 PM

It goes even further than that, Kube. OP means original post as well.

The OP in the OP is OP!

FDA_Approved · 10-25-2012, 07:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Snipe

OMFG I CANT RUN IN A DIRECT STRAIGHT LINE TO THE BUTTON/FLAG CAUSE THERES AN HW AND HE WILL OVERPRESSURE ME AND FUCK UP MY SPEED!!!!!!!1!!!1!! END OF WORLD!!!!!! OMG THEN I GOTTA START ALL THE WAY BACK AT MY RESPAWN AND TAKE ANOTHER 10 FUCKIN SECONDS TO GET BACK TO THE SAME SPOT!!!!!!!!!!!

lol you guys are silly. I rarely play HW, but when I do I enjoy using it. Keeps scouts and spies on their toes. While playing AGAINST an HW, I just stay the hell away from them. Which is what I did before overpressure was ever implemented.

Rofl I think you're the one that's actually over reacting here. Like neon said it's just implemented poorly, and it's just over all annoying. Also no offense but you've not even seen a fraction of what OP is capable of in the right hands.

**squeek.** · 10-25-2012, 10:12 PM

I think there are currently two problems with the overpressure:

First: Getting hit by it almost never makes sense. You blow by a HW just to get knocked back after you're SURE you got by him. That's just due to poor implementation on my part (something weird is going on with the lag compensation), but that can be fixed (and has been in the beta). I'm fairly confident this will help alleviate some frustration because, currently, when you're 1-on-1 with the HW and not going 1000+ speed (like when the HW is standing on the flag while the demo is gone), and he times his OP perfectly to get you away from the flag, it's not nearly as frustrating as usual (at least in my experience; I tend to respect what he was able to do).
Second: The cooldown is far too low. It's easy to feel futile when you're hit by the overpressure because it's basically a death in vain. It doesn't really cost the HW anything. If he missed, big whoop, it'll probably be back up by the time someone else comes along (and it'll FOR SURE be back up for your next run). A longer cooldown will make each and every use of the overpressure meaningful. The HW will have to choose carefully WHEN to use it, not just try to use it on every person he sees because why not.

Both of these issues will be addressed in the next patch, once I get off my lazy bones and finally release it. Another thought I had: currently, your air control gets nullified when you get hit by an overpressure. I might remove that part and just keep friction getting nullified so that you can still maneuver as long as you're in the air (but will slide along the ground).

FDA_Approved · 10-25-2012, 11:13 PM

Still pretty gay and I think people will still probly hate it. I really think it needs to be aimed like moto suggests, and it shouldn't be just complete stopping power, maybe if it slowed you down like the slow nade, but you don't speed back up afterwords.

Or if it were some kind of hitscan based knock back mechanic. Knock back, rather than, freeze tag.

Trailer · 10-26-2012, 03:28 AM

You're only 10 feet past the HW on your screen. Whenever I OP someone as HW, they are always right beside me on my screen, it never once has warped them back to me. It always makes perfect sense that it was either well timed, or a miss. As a scout on the otherhand, it seems to warp back. I also experience this with pipes though. Many times I will think I conced through the flag, and am home free only to be warped back and dead.

The range isn't as large as it seems to a lot of people. The reason you get warped back 20 feet isn't because OP has a 20 ft range, it's because of hit reg / lag comp. The range is really only about a radius of 5 feet, so you do have to actually be quite close for it to work.

Source has shitty hit reg, add characters flying through the air at 500 mph and you are destined for problems.

The cool down is maybe a little low, but it is also highly map and team work dependent. If the cool down is extended, I don't think it should be by more than 5-10 seconds. Lets look at and compare a few things. (This is pickup style play comparisons before you noobs start freaking out and/or saying go pyro)

Lets start out on destroy with HW ramp and soldier button. If one player goes button, what are the chances they make it (assuming it is a good soldier of course)? Generally, a one man team will get owned by a good soldier in that spot. Now, what happens if 2-4 players all rush button? I would say that even the best soldier in the game can only stop 2, MAYBE 3, but probably not.

Apply this same scenario to an HW at button, and you have the same result. No HW is going to be able to stop all 4, 2 or POSSIBLY 3 will go down, but most likely just 2.

Let's compare both classes ability to stop conc momentum. An HW stops you dead in your tracks and you are so close that the AC then shreds you apart in like 1 second. The soldier either stands in the back of a narrow corridor and shoots right in the center when you land and uses his 20 ft splash radius to hit you anywhere in that corridor OR predicts where you are going to land and shoots his feet when you do.

Rockets pop you up however, so it does leave a little more opportunity to still get away, but you usually don't.

The key difference I see is that the soldier damages himself in the process, but the effect is nearly the same. The soldier pays consequence for his tactic but the HW really doesn't.

Now, on larger maps like phantom, OP does seem a bit OP.

What do you think of these OP ideas.

Make overpressure pop up enemies like rockets do.

OR

Make OP do 1/5 damage to the HW like foot shooting soldiers have to deal with for their tactic

OR

Make it so the HW can only use OP a set amount of times per life. So instead of every 15 seconds forever, every 15 seconds but no more than 5 times per life or maybe even cool down / larger time frame ( every 15 seconds but not more than 5x/2 mins).

Still ironic though, despite all the HW OP rage, map cap averages remain the same on all maps, so although it seems damaging to the player caught by it, it doesn't seem all that damaging to the offense as a whole.

FDA_Approved · 10-26-2012, 04:07 AM

Heavy has to aim it, take dmg from it, and it's knock back rather than just a show stopper? Sounds better to me, although I can't really justify taking dmg for using it. I'd like that though.

**squeek.** · 10-26-2012, 05:12 AM

I kinda like the idea of the OP damaging the HW. I can't believe that hasn't been discussed before.

caesium · 10-26-2012, 10:36 AM

!ADRENALINE!OVERDOSE!

10-25-2012, 05:35 AM	#1
FDA_Approved Beta Tester Join Date: Nov 2011 Gametype: Capture the Flag Posts Rated Helpful 293 Times	Over pressure. Dear, FF. No one likes it. So gay. Even trailer doesn't like playing against that shit. Last edited by FDA_Approved; 10-25-2012 at 05:35 AM.
	1 members found this post helpful.

10-25-2012, 06:10 AM	#2
Raynian D&A Member Join Date: May 2009 Location: Ruining #pickups Class/Position: SPAWN CAMPING OH NO Gametype: Ragequitting Affiliations: [PMS]. [Shiney] Posts Rated Helpful 26 Times	Please get rid of this homosexual bullshit. Nobody likes being stopped dead after they pass the HW, or having a HW poke out behind a wall and your run is fucked. Give the HW caltrops as his secondary fire. Temporarily places a few around him, 30 second cooldown. Or just leave him with nothing since he's fine as is. __________________ 7:00 PM - zE: eh tbh i like some stuff in us but a lot of stuff in us messes with my nerves 7:00 PM - zE: like watching fox news 7:00 PM - zE: its like wtf
	1 members found this post helpful.

10-25-2012, 07:42 AM	#3
Trailer [Caleb] Beta Tester Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: South Carolina Class/Position: O Scout, D demo and Engy Gametype: Attack / Defend Affiliations: -nZ [LAW] TG M\|M TRISPIRAL (Back in the TFC days) Posts Rated Helpful 15 Times	I <3 overpressure. Threads like this make me <3 overpressure even more. __________________ You're not your job. You're not how much money you have in the bank. You're not the car you drive. You're not the contents of your wallet. You're not your fucking khakis. You're the all-singing, all-dancing crap of the world.

10-25-2012, 10:05 AM	#4
caesium Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: europe Class/Position: anything Gametype: everything Affiliations: #teamfail Posts Rated Helpful 27 Times	<3 well argued points.. but i gotta agree, imo overpressure's ghey - hate playing with it and hate playing against it. __________________ Support FF:

10-25-2012, 10:16 AM	#5
caesium Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: europe Class/Position: anything Gametype: everything Affiliations: #teamfail Posts Rated Helpful 27 Times	how about an "adrenaline overdose" that greatly increases your rate of fire (~2/3x?) but then after x seconds (~10/15?) you explode into gibs (cos your heart explodes ofc). obviously there'd be some clear onscreen effect like increasingly bulging veins in your god forsaken dying eyes. __________________ Support FF:
	1 members found this post helpful.

10-25-2012, 05:17 PM	#8
Trailer [Caleb] Beta Tester Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: South Carolina Class/Position: O Scout, D demo and Engy Gametype: Attack / Defend Affiliations: -nZ [LAW] TG M\|M TRISPIRAL (Back in the TFC days) Posts Rated Helpful 15 Times	It's only gay when I'm not the HW. =D __________________ You're not your job. You're not how much money you have in the bank. You're not the car you drive. You're not the contents of your wallet. You're not your fucking khakis. You're the all-singing, all-dancing crap of the world.

10-25-2012, 05:48 PM	#9
moosh WhenNailGrenWillOut? Beta Tester Join Date: May 2009 Gametype: mp_prematch Affiliations: [:)] - Frag Happy, babe\| Posts Rated Helpful 29 Times	I say give the HWG teleporters. __________________ [[ ff_hotfudge - bhop_theonlyone ]] "As the the new year approaches I await for it like an case of explosive fecalomania otherwise know as diareha or the massive shits. I am gripping the sides of the toilet as my stomach produces the first hollow thud out of the anus of the year to come." DarkeN_HellspawN

10-25-2012, 05:52 PM	#10
Snipe WhenGasGrenWillBack? Join Date: Mar 2009 Location: Maryland Class/Position: Sniper, Spy Gametype: Spy Deathmatch Posts Rated Helpful 3 Times	OMFG I CANT RUN IN A DIRECT STRAIGHT LINE TO THE BUTTON/FLAG CAUSE THERES AN HW AND HE WILL OVERPRESSURE ME AND FUCK UP MY SPEED!!!!!!!1!!!1!! END OF WORLD!!!!!! OMG THEN I GOTTA START ALL THE WAY BACK AT MY RESPAWN AND TAKE ANOTHER 10 FUCKIN SECONDS TO GET BACK TO THE SAME SPOT!!!!!!!!!!! lol you guys are silly. I rarely play HW, but when I do I enjoy using it. Keeps scouts and spies on their toes. While playing AGAINST an HW, I just stay the hell away from them. Which is what I did before overpressure was ever implemented.

10-25-2012, 06:09 PM	#12
KubeDawg Nade Whore Server Owner Beta Tester Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Oklahoma Class/Position: Scout/Soldier Gametype: CTF/TDM Affiliations: blunt. Moto Posts Rated Helpful 128 Times	When the OP radius is so big that it completely blocks some areas in their entirety, that's a problem for me. At most, this should be an add-on to the Assault Cannon to have a cone-based fire that has the same effects as the current OP, but it requires the HW to estimate where the enemy is concing towards. Overpressure was a good name for this feature as OP is also short for OVERPOWERED. __________________ Moto's Funhouse \| Dallas, TX - 74.91.114.247:27015 ff_plunder - Complete

10-25-2012, 06:21 PM	#13
XPelargos I like to spam binds Beta Tester Join Date: May 2009 Class/Position: Scoooooot Gametype: Capture the Flag Posts Rated Helpful 73 Times	It goes even further than that, Kube. OP means original post as well. The OP in the OP is OP!
	1 members found this post helpful.

10-25-2012, 10:12 PM	#15
squeek. Stuff Do-er Lua Team Wiki Team Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Northern California Class/Position: Rallygun Shooter Gametype: Conc tag (you just wait) Affiliations: Mustache Brigade Posts Rated Helpful 352 Times	I think there are currently two problems with the overpressure: First: Getting hit by it almost never makes sense. You blow by a HW just to get knocked back after you're SURE you got by him. That's just due to poor implementation on my part (something weird is going on with the lag compensation), but that can be fixed (and has been in the beta). I'm fairly confident this will help alleviate some frustration because, currently, when you're 1-on-1 with the HW and not going 1000+ speed (like when the HW is standing on the flag while the demo is gone), and he times his OP perfectly to get you away from the flag, it's not nearly as frustrating as usual (at least in my experience; I tend to respect what he was able to do). Second: The cooldown is far too low. It's easy to feel futile when you're hit by the overpressure because it's basically a death in vain. It doesn't really cost the HW anything. If he missed, big whoop, it'll probably be back up by the time someone else comes along (and it'll FOR SURE be back up for your next run). A longer cooldown will make each and every use of the overpressure meaningful. The HW will have to choose carefully WHEN to use it, not just try to use it on every person he sees because why not. Both of these issues will be addressed in the next patch, once I get off my lazy bones and finally release it. Another thought I had: currently, your air control gets nullified when you get hit by an overpressure. I might remove that part and just keep friction getting nullified so that you can still maneuver as long as you're in the air (but will slide along the ground). __________________ #FF.Pickup ¤ Fortress-Forever pickups My Non-official Maps Released FF_DM_Squeek - FF_2Mesa3_Classic - FF_Siege_Classic Beta FF_Myth - FF_Redlight_Greenlight Sick of the people on the internet, always moanin'. They just moan. - Karl Pilkington Last edited by squeek.; 10-25-2012 at 10:13 PM.

10-25-2012, 11:13 PM	#16
FDA_Approved Beta Tester Join Date: Nov 2011 Gametype: Capture the Flag Posts Rated Helpful 293 Times	Still pretty gay and I think people will still probly hate it. I really think it needs to be aimed like moto suggests, and it shouldn't be just complete stopping power, maybe if it slowed you down like the slow nade, but you don't speed back up afterwords. Or if it were some kind of hitscan based knock back mechanic. Knock back, rather than, freeze tag.

10-26-2012, 03:28 AM	#17
Trailer [Caleb] Beta Tester Join Date: Feb 2011 Location: South Carolina Class/Position: O Scout, D demo and Engy Gametype: Attack / Defend Affiliations: -nZ [LAW] TG M\|M TRISPIRAL (Back in the TFC days) Posts Rated Helpful 15 Times	You're only 10 feet past the HW on your screen. Whenever I OP someone as HW, they are always right beside me on my screen, it never once has warped them back to me. It always makes perfect sense that it was either well timed, or a miss. As a scout on the otherhand, it seems to warp back. I also experience this with pipes though. Many times I will think I conced through the flag, and am home free only to be warped back and dead. The range isn't as large as it seems to a lot of people. The reason you get warped back 20 feet isn't because OP has a 20 ft range, it's because of hit reg / lag comp. The range is really only about a radius of 5 feet, so you do have to actually be quite close for it to work. Source has shitty hit reg, add characters flying through the air at 500 mph and you are destined for problems. The cool down is maybe a little low, but it is also highly map and team work dependent. If the cool down is extended, I don't think it should be by more than 5-10 seconds. Lets look at and compare a few things. (This is pickup style play comparisons before you noobs start freaking out and/or saying go pyro) Lets start out on destroy with HW ramp and soldier button. If one player goes button, what are the chances they make it (assuming it is a good soldier of course)? Generally, a one man team will get owned by a good soldier in that spot. Now, what happens if 2-4 players all rush button? I would say that even the best soldier in the game can only stop 2, MAYBE 3, but probably not. Apply this same scenario to an HW at button, and you have the same result. No HW is going to be able to stop all 4, 2 or POSSIBLY 3 will go down, but most likely just 2. Let's compare both classes ability to stop conc momentum. An HW stops you dead in your tracks and you are so close that the AC then shreds you apart in like 1 second. The soldier either stands in the back of a narrow corridor and shoots right in the center when you land and uses his 20 ft splash radius to hit you anywhere in that corridor OR predicts where you are going to land and shoots his feet when you do. Rockets pop you up however, so it does leave a little more opportunity to still get away, but you usually don't. The key difference I see is that the soldier damages himself in the process, but the effect is nearly the same. The soldier pays consequence for his tactic but the HW really doesn't. Now, on larger maps like phantom, OP does seem a bit OP. What do you think of these OP ideas. Make overpressure pop up enemies like rockets do. OR Make OP do 1/5 damage to the HW like foot shooting soldiers have to deal with for their tactic OR Make it so the HW can only use OP a set amount of times per life. So instead of every 15 seconds forever, every 15 seconds but no more than 5 times per life or maybe even cool down / larger time frame ( every 15 seconds but not more than 5x/2 mins). Still ironic though, despite all the HW OP rage, map cap averages remain the same on all maps, so although it seems damaging to the player caught by it, it doesn't seem all that damaging to the offense as a whole. __________________ You're not your job. You're not how much money you have in the bank. You're not the car you drive. You're not the contents of your wallet. You're not your fucking khakis. You're the all-singing, all-dancing crap of the world. Last edited by Trailer; 10-26-2012 at 03:34 AM.

10-26-2012, 04:07 AM	#18
FDA_Approved Beta Tester Join Date: Nov 2011 Gametype: Capture the Flag Posts Rated Helpful 293 Times	Heavy has to aim it, take dmg from it, and it's knock back rather than just a show stopper? Sounds better to me, although I can't really justify taking dmg for using it. I'd like that though.

10-26-2012, 05:12 AM	#19
squeek. Stuff Do-er Lua Team Wiki Team Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Northern California Class/Position: Rallygun Shooter Gametype: Conc tag (you just wait) Affiliations: Mustache Brigade Posts Rated Helpful 352 Times	I kinda like the idea of the OP damaging the HW. I can't believe that hasn't been discussed before. __________________ #FF.Pickup ¤ Fortress-Forever pickups My Non-official Maps Released FF_DM_Squeek - FF_2Mesa3_Classic - FF_Siege_Classic Beta FF_Myth - FF_Redlight_Greenlight Sick of the people on the internet, always moanin'. They just moan. - Karl Pilkington

10-26-2012, 10:36 AM	#20
caesium Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: europe Class/Position: anything Gametype: everything Affiliations: #teamfail Posts Rated Helpful 27 Times	!ADRENALINE!OVERDOSE! __________________ Support FF:
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