Top 3 reasons why TF2 failed competitvely - Page 2

Bridget · 12-13-2010, 11:19 PM

I think posting that sort-of picture out of the blue says more about you than me, reaper.

reaper18 · 12-13-2010, 11:23 PM

Please, tell me who i am based on a picture

oaties · 12-13-2010, 11:30 PM

Im rather reluctant to admit it, but TF2 is a very good game.

Although I do admit that many of the unlockable weapons suck, at least the updates brought life back into the game.

Now Bridget, the blatant upgrades of tf2: The Equalizer, the Ubersaw, the Blutsauger (arguably).

Also, by auto-aim sniper rifle im thinking that he either means the Hunstman (that would be retarded on his part if this is the case) or the Sydney Sleeper. Both of them don't auto-aim, but they are intended for an unskilled player.

If you are annoyed playing instant respawn servers, you should try this server I currently play alot. It is vanilla, 24 man, stock rotation, regular respawn server that is commonly populated with relatively good players: http://critsandvich.com/

Not that I'm trying to advertise my server or anything, but if you happen to join because of reading this message, my ingame name is "Csn| oaties".

Bridget · 12-13-2010, 11:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oaties

Now Bridget, the blatant upgrades of tf2: The Equalizer, the Ubersaw, the Blutsauger (arguably).

My point was that almost all of the non-stock weapons are side-grades. Personally, I wouldn't include the Blutsauger in that list. That's 2 weapons out of 50-60 some that are considered blatant upgrades?

Quote:

Originally Posted by oaties

Also, by auto-aim sniper rifle im thinking that he either means the Hunstman (that would be retarded on his part if this is the case) or the Sydney Sleeper. Both of them don't auto-aim, but they are intended for an unskilled player.

I figured it had to be one of those two. Neither of them auto-aim, and only one of them is actually a Sniper Rifle, so I don't know what the hell he is talking about.

AfterShock · 12-13-2010, 11:48 PM

I think the majority of people that are peeved with TF2 because basically, it could have been so much more.

Yeah, it's popular, and its an ok game, but its nowhere near the follow up to TFC that I personally was hoping for.

oaties · 12-13-2010, 11:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by AfterShock

I think the majority of people that are peeved with TF2 because basically, it could have been so much more.

Yeah, it's popular, and its an ok game, but its nowhere near the follow up to TFC that I personally was hoping for.

In a pub sense, I would have to say it exceeds the enjoyment tfc ever gave. In TFC, there really wasn't much class balance. Pyro was weak, engineer was weak in pubs, soldier was the best etc. In TF2, EVERY class has to work together in order to win.

GenghisTron · 12-14-2010, 01:23 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Crazycarl

TF2 didn't fail. It made Valve tons of money, thousands of people play it and it's fun. The characters and the entire IP is extremely valuable to them in terms of brand loyalty--It's one more Valve game that people love.

This.

Valve made an immensely successful game and they fundamentally altered the protocols of traditional game making. They added MMORPG elements to an FPS game, and it made them tons of cash and created tons of interest for their game. Not to mention, it has a very popular competitive scene. Measuring TF2 as anything other than a success is just plain confirmation bias, and is purely subjective.

Raynian · 12-14-2010, 01:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oaties

In a pub sense, I would have to say it exceeds the enjoyment tfc ever gave. In TFC, there really wasn't much class balance. Pyro was weak, engineer was weak in pubs, soldier was the best etc. In TF2, EVERY class has to work together in order to win.

Because engies were clearly the best at capping flags.

Holy fuck people. Class balance does NOT mean every class needs to be average in all things. It doesn't matter that scouts in TFC/FF can't kill shit, they're good because they run flags. Heavies tear through people at chokes. TFC was balanced because there was a REASON to run a specific class in a specific situation. Even pyros had a use.

TF2's classes (with the exception of medic and, arguably, engineer) are 75% the same - point at enemy, click, see who dies first. A bit of juking but all the classes are based around kill the enemy team, THEN accomplish objectives.

It's why in pickups (at least a while ago, I don't follow the TF2 comp scene) there's always one medic (because medics are OP when your team knows how to work together, and UP if your team is fucktarded) and one demo, the rest can choose whatever classes they want. What, so you're telling me that it's just as good to run 4 pyros on O instead of scouts?

The fuck?

Right, since every class revolves around "kill the enemy in half a second".

Bridget · 12-14-2010, 01:43 AM

That's why it's sucessful. People play first-person shooters to kill people. Why do you think, besides the lack of structure, pubbers always resort to just ditching the objectives and deathmatching? It's fun. Team Fortress 2 capitalized on that fact, and made it so by deathmatching, you achieve the objectives. Ta-da! Genius!

Also, waiting for you to answer my concerns, Majesty. You make a subjective bullshit thread where your misunderstandings of the game guide your judgement of it, then avoid making a response when people point out said misunderstandings. Hur~

Pixel · 12-14-2010, 02:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Bridget

pubbers always resort to just ditching the objectives and deathmatching?

This is freaking annoying. GET ON THE FUCKING CART FOR FUCKS SAKE.

Majesty · 12-14-2010, 05:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oaties

Also, by auto-aim sniper rifle im thinking that he either means the Hunstman (that would be retarded on his part if this is the case)

Yup, I admit it. I was retarded for a minute there. Haha.

Quote:

If you are annoyed playing instant respawn servers, you should try this server I currently play alot. It is vanilla, 24 man, stock rotation, regular respawn server that is commonly populated with relatively good players: http://critsandvich.com/

Not that I'm trying to advertise my server or anything, but if you happen to join because of reading this message, my ingame name is "Csn| oaties".

Thanks, man. That is really tempting... hm.. but I have quite a bit of work to do around here. Ah well.

Quote:

Originally Posted by bridget

...

YouTube

zE · 12-14-2010, 01:25 PM

top reason why tf2 failed wtf : D TF2 is uber popular and its the biggest fortress game out there if you can put it in that category.

Bridget · 12-15-2010, 01:13 AM

Top 3 reasons why this thread failed:

Thread author bases his opinion on his own personal misunderstandings.
Thread author ignores fact that Team Fortress 2 is actually a commercial success.
Thread author is reluctant to defend himself when challenged.

**Crazycarl** · 12-15-2010, 01:14 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by oaties

If you are annoyed playing instant respawn servers, you should try this server I currently play alot. It is vanilla, 24 man, stock rotation, regular respawn server that is commonly populated with relatively good players: http://critsandvich.com/

Not that I'm trying to advertise my server or anything, but if you happen to join because of reading this message, my ingame name is "Csn| oaties".

I've played there and it is quite good. Doesn't hurt that I get great ping to servers located in Chicago.

Born_In_Xixax · 12-15-2010, 04:09 AM

Check out these class stats from that critsandvich.com server: http://critsandvich.com/hlstatsx/hls...=roles&game=tf

If my goal was to balance the 9 classes as evenly as possible (notwithstanding the medic, a pure support class,) I would be ecstatic with those stats.

IMHO TF2 is a triumphant success for the fortress franchise, brilliantly solving most of the endemic flaws in TFC, adding super amounts of personality, wit and creativity but sadly simplifying the game down to a rock/paper/scissors exercise with some trudging, anemic DM involved. TFC/FF's grenade system and creative movement add an extra two full dimensions of tactics and skill to the gameplay - of course at the cost of bewildering difficulty for newbs.

Majesty · 12-15-2010, 06:34 AM

I changed the thread title to make my intentions more clear.

Here you can see all of the modifications done to servers. Most change respawn times (setting them to usually 5 seconds or less), up the player count, etc. One I thought is funny is upping critical hit chance. One I liked is lowering the chance. I'm not saying it's impossible to find good servers, but it's pretty much the most annoying aspect to playing the game.

The custom items never really broke TF2, but stuff like kritzkrieg, Blutsauger are both shameful weapons that were meant to hopefully make people play as medic more. Most of the items do a great job at presevering the gameplay, and even are a nice change now and again. But as it was already mentioned, medics are a must-- something I'm fine with, but really, there isn't much you can do except sac the medic and hope for the best.(eg. medic+heavy VS soldier... vs... anything)

The best step in the right direction was http://tf2lobby.com/. This is where a lot of good players go. But lately, the player count has been astronomically low.

Again, I don't think TF2 failed in it's own right. But I think the original intentions for the game did fail and Valve had to change where they were heading, another smart move by them. But, this game, no matter how popular it is still sucks at producing good matches. When you hit a certain level of skill, then it's time to make a hard switch to the hidden class: commander. This role involves teaching new players the game, managing attacks and defenses without sounding like a dick/micro manager, and knowing where to focus your efforts for the team. Have any of you that are defending TF2 found this class yet? Probably not. Instead, I'm sure most of you have spent your time bartering for the next coolest hat, or item.

This is the point I'm trying to make. TF is not a fucking MMO. I should not observe terrible players accounting nothing to my team, trading items in game. The focus, instead on teamwork, has been displaced and has mutated into something that doesn't belong-- to serve up a cheap $1 double cheeseburger to the dense-minded playerbase. Just like McDonnalds is world wide and well known, doesn't mean they make good food. Point made.

Bridget · 12-15-2010, 07:57 AM

Still waiting for evidence that over 90% of the servers in TF2 use instant respawn.

Majesty · 12-15-2010, 09:17 AM

You can purchase the evidence for $4.99 + tax, or you can craft it from other items you find around the forums.

Bridget · 12-15-2010, 09:56 AM

As expected, most of what you say is made-up non-sense pulled from your ass.

GenghisTron · 12-15-2010, 11:07 AM

This whole thing just comes off as an elaborate way to pay extensive lip service to FF and bolster the communities' opinion of yourself. Instead of focusing on the perceived failures of a rival game, why not focus your attention into more creative avenues, such as the game you're supposed to be helping 'develop'. What you're doing is vanity, and this game needs a lot less vanity, and a lot more substance

12-13-2010, 11:48 PM	#25
AfterShock Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts Rated Helpful 45 Times	I think the majority of people that are peeved with TF2 because basically, it could have been so much more. Yeah, it's popular, and its an ok game, but its nowhere near the follow up to TFC that I personally was hoping for. Last edited by AfterShock; 12-13-2010 at 11:48 PM.

12-15-2010, 01:13 AM	#33
Bridget Banned Join Date: Sep 2008 Class/Position: Soldier Gametype: AVD Affiliations: TALOS Posts Rated Helpful 5 Times	Top 3 reasons why this thread failed: Thread author bases his opinion on his own personal misunderstandings. Thread author ignores fact that Team Fortress 2 is actually a commercial success. Thread author is reluctant to defend himself when challenged.

12-15-2010, 11:07 AM	#40
GenghisTron AKA LittleAndroidMan D&A Member Beta Tester Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Dystopia Class/Position: Demo/Medic Gametype: CTF Affiliations: [TALOS] [SR] Posts Rated Helpful 11 Times	This whole thing just comes off as an elaborate way to pay extensive lip service to FF and bolster the communities' opinion of yourself. Instead of focusing on the perceived failures of a rival game, why not focus your attention into more creative avenues, such as the game you're supposed to be helping 'develop'. What you're doing is vanity, and this game needs a lot less vanity, and a lot more substance __________________ The Catacombs Steam Last.fm

12-13-2010, 11:19 PM	#21
Bridget Banned Join Date: Sep 2008 Class/Position: Soldier Gametype: AVD Affiliations: TALOS Posts Rated Helpful 5 Times	I think posting that sort-of picture out of the blue says more about you than me, reaper.

12-13-2010, 11:23 PM	#22
reaper18 sKeeD D&A Member Beta Tester Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Pittsburgh, PA Class/Position: Scout, Demo, Solly Gametype: Any Posts Rated Helpful 21 Times	Please, tell me who i am based on a picture

12-13-2010, 11:30 PM	#23
oaties Join Date: Nov 2010 Gametype: Capture the Flag Posts Rated Helpful 38 Times	Im rather reluctant to admit it, but TF2 is a very good game. Although I do admit that many of the unlockable weapons suck, at least the updates brought life back into the game. Now Bridget, the blatant upgrades of tf2: The Equalizer, the Ubersaw, the Blutsauger (arguably). Also, by auto-aim sniper rifle im thinking that he either means the Hunstman (that would be retarded on his part if this is the case) or the Sydney Sleeper. Both of them don't auto-aim, but they are intended for an unskilled player. If you are annoyed playing instant respawn servers, you should try this server I currently play alot. It is vanilla, 24 man, stock rotation, regular respawn server that is commonly populated with relatively good players: http://critsandvich.com/ Not that I'm trying to advertise my server or anything, but if you happen to join because of reading this message, my ingame name is "Csn\| oaties".

12-14-2010, 01:43 AM	#29
Bridget Banned Join Date: Sep 2008 Class/Position: Soldier Gametype: AVD Affiliations: TALOS Posts Rated Helpful 5 Times	That's why it's sucessful. People play first-person shooters to kill people. Why do you think, besides the lack of structure, pubbers always resort to just ditching the objectives and deathmatching? It's fun. Team Fortress 2 capitalized on that fact, and made it so by deathmatching, you achieve the objectives. Ta-da! Genius! Also, waiting for you to answer my concerns, Majesty. You make a subjective bullshit thread where your misunderstandings of the game guide your judgement of it, then avoid making a response when people point out said misunderstandings. Hur~

12-14-2010, 01:25 PM	#32
zE Pew pew ze beams Join Date: Jan 2008 Gametype: Gathers Affiliations: pew pew Posts Rated Helpful 11 Times	top reason why tf2 failed wtf : D TF2 is uber popular and its the biggest fortress game out there if you can put it in that category.

12-15-2010, 04:09 AM	#35
Born_In_Xixax Join Date: Nov 2009 Gametype: Capture the Flag Posts Rated Helpful 1 Times	Check out these class stats from that critsandvich.com server: http://critsandvich.com/hlstatsx/hls...=roles&game=tf If my goal was to balance the 9 classes as evenly as possible (notwithstanding the medic, a pure support class,) I would be ecstatic with those stats. IMHO TF2 is a triumphant success for the fortress franchise, brilliantly solving most of the endemic flaws in TFC, adding super amounts of personality, wit and creativity but sadly simplifying the game down to a rock/paper/scissors exercise with some trudging, anemic DM involved. TFC/FF's grenade system and creative movement add an extra two full dimensions of tactics and skill to the gameplay - of course at the cost of bewildering difficulty for newbs.

12-15-2010, 06:34 AM	#36
Majesty D&A Member Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: USA, Ohio Class/Position: Scout Gametype: CTF Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	I changed the thread title to make my intentions more clear. Here you can see all of the modifications done to servers. Most change respawn times (setting them to usually 5 seconds or less), up the player count, etc. One I thought is funny is upping critical hit chance. One I liked is lowering the chance. I'm not saying it's impossible to find good servers, but it's pretty much the most annoying aspect to playing the game. The custom items never really broke TF2, but stuff like kritzkrieg, Blutsauger are both shameful weapons that were meant to hopefully make people play as medic more. Most of the items do a great job at presevering the gameplay, and even are a nice change now and again. But as it was already mentioned, medics are a must-- something I'm fine with, but really, there isn't much you can do except sac the medic and hope for the best.(eg. medic+heavy VS soldier... vs... anything) The best step in the right direction was http://tf2lobby.com/. This is where a lot of good players go. But lately, the player count has been astronomically low. Again, I don't think TF2 failed in it's own right. But I think the original intentions for the game did fail and Valve had to change where they were heading, another smart move by them. But, this game, no matter how popular it is still sucks at producing good matches. When you hit a certain level of skill, then it's time to make a hard switch to the hidden class: commander. This role involves teaching new players the game, managing attacks and defenses without sounding like a dick/micro manager, and knowing where to focus your efforts for the team. Have any of you that are defending TF2 found this class yet? Probably not. Instead, I'm sure most of you have spent your time bartering for the next coolest hat, or item. This is the point I'm trying to make. TF is not a fucking MMO. I should not observe terrible players accounting nothing to my team, trading items in game. The focus, instead on teamwork, has been displaced and has mutated into something that doesn't belong-- to serve up a cheap $1 double cheeseburger to the dense-minded playerbase. Just like McDonnalds is world wide and well known, doesn't mean they make good food. Point made.

12-15-2010, 07:57 AM	#37
Bridget Banned Join Date: Sep 2008 Class/Position: Soldier Gametype: AVD Affiliations: TALOS Posts Rated Helpful 5 Times	Still waiting for evidence that over 90% of the servers in TF2 use instant respawn.

12-15-2010, 09:17 AM	#38
Majesty D&A Member Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Nov 2010 Location: USA, Ohio Class/Position: Scout Gametype: CTF Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	You can purchase the evidence for $4.99 + tax, or you can craft it from other items you find around the forums.

12-15-2010, 09:56 AM	#39
Bridget Banned Join Date: Sep 2008 Class/Position: Soldier Gametype: AVD Affiliations: TALOS Posts Rated Helpful 5 Times	As expected, most of what you say is made-up non-sense pulled from your ass.

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