whats beyond the universe?

[o_captain_cadaver]

Believe in what helps you sleep at night, whether its God, Buddah, or yourself and no other. If you dont need to believe in a God, that's fine. If you think my God is a hoax, whatever, thats fine too. You guys can bash each other until your blue in the face, but the reality is that you cant prove God's exsistence or nonexsistence. Its like holding an argument with whether there are invisible microscopic pixie fairies, can you prove they're there, or not there...no. So ask the people of this forum, what is the piont of arguing, you cant expect to break a paradigm overnight, and you cant expect someone to except christ in their lives just by arguing points. Just believe what you want, wallow in your "ignorance", and dont be a douche by pointing at others.

[o_binarylife]

Thanks Captain. I consistantly loose track of myself. I remember back when I said I wont discuss this in the forums... and there I go.


Im out. For the record, Captain kicks ass.

[o_catzeyes93]

I thought I would chip in my two cents as well.

My observations is that some of us in the human race have attempted to find the meaning of life. With this comes a study of the different religions that offer their own version of why we are here and what our purpose is.

While I truely dont have a problem with those that are seeking and are attempting to hash out the details, I DO have a problem with those that seek and ultimately decide to take pieces of many religions to form their own version of what they think they need to do to be a 'good' person.

No. I am sorry, but no no no. This is like a child telling a parent that while he agrees dinner is at 5:00, school is required and fighting is to be avoided at all costs, but that he doesnt agree with the 8:00 bedtime rule. No. You cannot choose to be a part of this family and decide what you want to do just simply because it is what you want. If you are a part of this family, you accept ALL privleges and requirements outlined by the family code.

All in all... if you are going to choose a religion to base your life and belief system on, I would recomend the one that is based on a man that provided an extraordinary event... such as rising from the dead. Lining up all the religions, this is the only one that offers recorded proof that the grave of Jesus was left empty.

[o_ekim]

weetbix I hope for your sake you're trolling. If so, you've done a good job. I am incredibly angry after reading your posts. That someone so bigoted, ignorant and blind can claim to be a Christian offends me. You, sir, are not a Christian. You do not follow the teachings of Christ.

the reason why im against homosexuality is because under christianity homosexuality is a sin... thats pretty much the basis for my discriminative comments.

Hey, could you quote me some Bible passages condeming homosexuality? I bet you haven't even read the good book. You just use it as a rationalisation for your in-built prejudices.

I am not responding to the rest of your garbage because I'd flame you. Suffice to say it is all born of ignorance and repulsive.

One question : how many gay people do you know?

[o_billdoor]

Originally Posted by |404|Innoc-TPF-

Travis, I won't deny that there is a benefit to me in the volunteer work and donating I do. I feel better doing it. Personally I think it feels better to be involved and to be trying to make a difference rather than sitting on the sidelines casting aspursions at those who do. As Christians there are many things we're called to do. Most of them do not involve money.

But do you ever think clearly about the benefits of the work you do? I do volunteer work as well, but can you honestly give a precise and detailed description of why your volunteer work is a "good thing"? I can't -- I know it benefits some people, but of course I also know that benefit is payed for by others in our community.

I know you admit that it feels good to do it -- I feel that as well, but I know it doesn't end there. What we have to consider is that for everyone that benefits in our world, there is someone that suffers. The western world benefits because Africans and the people of other poor areas work to earn just enough to support themselves. I think many aid agencies are actually making the problem worse because they are increasing the limit of "just poor enough to survive" without also increasing the price of labour in the third world. Fuck those Christians that promote a message of redemption through meekness. Those who have judgment here preach the virtues of the life to come, it's fucking ridiculous.

[o_simmadown]

Originally Posted by billdoor

The western world benefits because Africans and the people of other poor areas work to earn just enough to support themselves.

What a total load of horseshit that is. Those countries suffer because.....what? Because we don't give them enough?

-Simma

[o_darknight]

Originally Posted by ekiM

weetbix I hope for your sake you're trolling. If so, you've done a good job. I am incredibly angry after reading your posts. That someone so bigoted, ignorant and blind can claim to be a Christian offends me. You, sir, are not a Christian. You do not follow the teachings of Christ.

Hey, could you quote me some Bible passages condeming homosexuality? I bet you haven't even read the good book. You just use it as a rationalisation for your in-built prejudices.

I am not responding to the rest of your garbage because I'd flame you. Suffice to say it is all born of ignorance and repulsive.

One question : how many gay people do you know?

The feelings are mutual eKiM and not just from me.

And as you said yourself weetabix.

"It is better to keep your mouth closed and let people think you are a fool than to open it and remove all doubt."

I'm not gonna say anything else atm. Gonna give myself time.

[o_ekim]

Originally Posted by simmadown

What a total load of horseshit that is. Those countries suffer because.....what? Because we don't give them enough?

-Simma

Because EUropean and US argiculture is subsidised too heavily by the respective governments leading to produce being dumped in African markets, leaving African producers unable to make a profit big enough to live off..

[o_simmadown]

Originally Posted by ekiM

Because EUropean and US argiculture is subsidised too heavily.

I'll research the European subsidy system when I have more time, but let me just speak to the U.S. subsidy program. Less than 1/3 of U.S. farmers receive subsidies. 80% of the recipients between 1995 and 2003 received, on average, $6,918 for the entire period. And U.S. subsidies go to farmers for NOT growing certain things. We pay farmer to not grow stuff. In fact, on my way from work either this morning or yesterday (can't remember), I was listening to National Public Radio (NPR), and heard an article about the U.S. paying farmers in certain areas of the mid-west to let their farms go to pot. They want certain natural grasses to make a comback. They get paid for NOT growing stuff. While I think the subsidy program is absolutely insane (let the free market of supply and demand reign), I don't see how they harm African nations.

-Simma

[o_ping_chow_chi]

just a little link,

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/business/1985104.stm

I happen to think that the problems in Africa run a lot deeper than just farm subsides though.

[o_billdoor]

Originally Posted by simmadown

We pay farmer to not grow stuff ... They want certain natural grasses to make a comback.

This happens in Europe too, under the pretense of "fallow field" agriculture. In reality, it's just market manipulation to ensure that the price of a certain good doesn't drop too low. Often happens when there's a bumper crop/excess supply.

[o_deadly furby]

Originally Posted by ekiM

Because EUropean and US argiculture is subsidised too heavily by the respective governments leading to produce being dumped in African markets, leaving African producers unable to make a profit big enough to live off..

Sounds like teenage rationale

[o_etzell]

Originally Posted by ekiM

Hey, could you quote me some Bible passages condeming homosexuality? I bet you haven't even read the good book. You just use it as a rationalisation for your in-built prejudices.

I dunno if he can, but I can.
Not saying that I believe it or anything, but it's there.

[o_ekim]

Go on then. The exercise was whether he knew what the Bible actually says.

[o_etzell]

Leviticus 18:22

Originally Posted by The Bible

Thou shalt not lie with mankind, as with womankind: it is abomination.

Leviticus 20:13

Originally Posted by The Bible

And if a man lie with mankind, as with womankind, both of them have committed abomination: they shall surely be put to death; their blood shall be upon them.

Good enough?

[o_ekim]

Yep, I know those passages are there. Leviticus 20:18 condems those who have sex with a woman on her period. I'm interested in whether weetabix is so vehmently behind that rule. Or the rules suggesting wearing clothes of more than one fabric is sinful.

[o_etzell]

I doubt it, because most people just decide to pick and choose what parts of the Bible to enforce.

[o_qui]

Originally Posted by Etzell

I doubt it, because most people just decide to pick and choose what parts of the Bible to enforce.

Which is another reason why i think its such bullshit.

[o_|404|innoc-tpf-]

Guys, for a Christian, the New Testament is more relevant as that is the life and teaching of Christ and the activities of the early church. This doesn't make the Old Testament irrelevant but it's lessons are somewhat diminished when cast against the words of Christ.

Bill, how do I know that my volunteer work is good for those that I help? Good? Bad? Indifferent? The bulk of what I do is work with the Sunday School Program and have done so for over 10 years. There are aspects of human life that are no different whether you're a Christian or a non-believer. As part of that the same societal ill's occur in probably the same ratios....we're all human after all. Frequently I am an ear for these kids. To simply listen and allow them to be heard. It's a remarkable thing...how rarely kids are actually listened to. The one time I listened to a little girl share something about how she was being abused and brought that to the attention of someone in a position to do something....if I accomplish nothing else...in that one moment all my volunteer time was worthwhile. I also aid those who are unable to do thing for themselves or by themselves. I work locally.

As far as Africa goes...the Warlords and Political structure is a far larger problem than anything else. What would you see done Bill? Remove all Aid and simply let people starve and die of their diseases unaided? Africa's problems do not stem from nonsense subsidies in the US, UK or elsewhere. Africas problems are internal.

[o_|404|innoc-tpf-]

Originally Posted by qui

Which is another reason why i think its such bullshit.

People pick and choose all the time. Take traffic laws...because some people pick and choose what they follow does that make the rest of the traffic laws BS? Of course not.