Immigrants - Whose culture is it?

[o_don]

This is totally a cliche topic. But, I was wondering about your thoughts.

Article's (and video) like this got me thinking:

Muslim Pc refused to shake hands

Cartoon protester urged murder

Drawing w/ Muhammad video (contains cautionary disclaimer)

What is most important?


Your nation to adapt to an immigrant's culture.

The immigrant to adapt to your nation's culture.

Both.


P.S. I do not intend for this article to have a slant towards the Muslim religion. They are just a highly media-covered example.

[o_psycnet]

Here in Canada alot of people argue that the Chinese refuse to accept our culture, and can go their entire lives almost never having to interact with English speaking people.

As it stands though, these aren't the people we should care about. 1st generation immigrants are just that, because after the 1st, their children are naturalized english-speaking citizens who have been brought up in a Canadian (or British or American) society.

As far as public dress, private groups and businesses should be able to make any rule they so wish as to who can and cannot enter. This is their fundamental right to not allow say people with headcoverings into a specific restaurant. Of course, PCism tends to get in the way of personal rights and logic, but as far as private business stands, they should have the right to refuse anyone anything based on any grounds they wish.

Public houses on the other hand (gov't run) should be so secular as to include and adjust for all religions.

[o_zsilver_fox]

Persoanlly, I think they should be respected. The Pilgrims of America should have respected the customs and cultures of the Native Americans, as should have all immigrants.

Unfortunately, that won't happen with humans.

[o_don]

Originally Posted by PsYcNeT

As it stands though, these aren't the people we should care about. 1st generation immigrants are just that, because after the 1st, their children are naturalized english-speaking citizens who have been brought up in a Canadian (or British or American) society.

Interesting, I hadn't thought about it like that. I guess that applies - it's a generational problem in some cases.

As far as public dress, private groups and businesses should be able to make any rule they so wish as to who can and cannot enter. This is their fundamental right to not allow say people with headcoverings into a specific restaurant.

Ya I agree here, so long as only dress is involved. When it comes to matters that people have no control over, such as skin colour, disability etc. then I would say selective admission to private areas is discrimination. However on matters that people are not bound by, say, religious dress or simply personal dress style, then for me it is acceptable and non-discriminatory. I'm sure someone will find a scenario in which what I have written is flawed. I'll be interested to read it.

[mervaka]

The immigrant to adapt to your nation's culture.

quite blatently. this retains identity, cultures and traditions.

i mean, look at Diane Abbott. shes a black MP. 2nd generation english at best, has fuck all to do with british history, and brands a cornish folklore event racist.

EDIT: second generation, her parents are jamaican immigrants.

[o_qwertyuiop]

I think immigrants should not be able to come into someone else's country and then expect everyone to go out of their ways so the immigrant can live like they did in their original country.

[o_broodingdude]

Huh... an immigrant should learn the culture in which they are coming to. Then, if the immigrant's culture follows the laws established long before their coming, they can still practice their own culture, but be prepared to give an explanation to the curious or misunderstanding. "That's the way it is" is a fucking cop-out, for stupid people.

[o_ihmhi]

Well, Teddy Roosevelt said...

Originally Posted by Teddy Roosevelt, 26th President of the United States

In the first place we should insist that if the immigrant who comes here in good faith becomes an American and assimilates himself to us, he shall be treated on an exact equality with everyone else, for it is an outrage to discriminate against any such man because of creed, or birthplace, or origin. But this is predicated upon the man's becoming in very fact an American, and nothing but an American...There can be no divided allegiance here. Any man who says he is an American, but something else also, isn't an American at all. We have room for but one flag, the American flag, and this excludes the red flag, which symbolizes all wars against liberty and civilization, just as much as it excludes any foreign flag of a nation to which we are hostile...We have room for but one language here, and that is the English language...and we have room for but one sole loyalty and that is a loyalty to the American people.

Originally Posted by Teddy Roosevelt, 26th President of the United States

Every immigrant who comes here should be required within five years to learn English or leave the country.

I think on matters of practicality alone he is right. We have to have one language and one flag.

Tell me, if you had someone who was in your home but did not respect your home, would you not kick them out? You would not kick someone out because of their skin color or their religious belief (I should hope not, at least). But so long as they are under your roof, they must respect that you provide for them and abide by your rules.

Immigrants are "under our roof" (so to speak). We provide for them with protection by the military and police, health via social programs and hospitals, and education via public schools. The least they can do is learn our language and respect our country because it is us that provide for them.

Yes, America was founded by immigrants. Many, if not most, of those immigrants' children live in America today. They speak English and they respect our country. The immigrants of today do not have to start a whole new government or fight to defend the country from a threat to its livelihood, but the people who founded this nation did. If our ancestors could go to the trouble to learn English and salute the American flag, then it stands to reason that we should ask no less of the immigrants of today.

[o_psycnet]

I'd really like to know how many Italian 1st generation immigrants ever bothered to learn english within the last century, or just left the local language to their children