Bunny Hopping (Bhoping)

[o_zaskar]

Originally Posted by Darknight

People bitch about being killed in-game. So should we not kill them next time?

lol my feelings exactly.

im a douche though, people bitch about nail nades or whatever else im doing and then i just target them and do it to them as much as possible :/

Almost as fun as singling out that 1 score whoring sniper and just trying to destroy his score as much as possible, rofl so much fun and they get so mad.

[o_imbrifer]

Anti-Bunnyhoppers: We don't like bunnyhopping because we don't like someone else moving around faster than us and upsetting the gameplay balance.
Bunnyhoppers: We like moving faster than others and upsetting their gameplay balance because it helps us do better.

Just so happens that the FF team is the latter. I hope that it isn't so weird that new players get frustrated by being killed by bunnyhoppers and leave the community.

I hope it can be toggled on servers.

[Jiggles]

For a second there, I was angry at someone for bumping an old thread.

[o_yoda891]

Originally Posted by Zaskar

Was talking about TFC, and if the server has No set rules people still bitch about someone using 1 and not the other.

And IM not playingnthe moral holiness card, i usually pull out any dirty trick that i have fun with, its others using one cause alot of people us it then bitch about something else that technically is just as "wrong". So many people fight against that 1 simple fact its kind of weird.

No i dont care about that though, use it all you want, i would even it people refered to it as a sploit (that it technically is)

Sorry to rain on your parade with the nail exploit analogy, but just because something is an exploit doesn't make the same reasoning applicable to another exploit. It's like saying that cutting a rock is just as bad as cutting a human, because they are both solid objects. But we all know that they are not the same, because there is reasoning outside what they have in common that seperates them. 1- a human is a living thing 2- a human can feel pain, a rock has no feelings. The same reasoning I have here is applicable to your analogy. 1- bunnyhopping is available to all classes, offense and defence, so it will not have a negative impact on the balance of the game. 2- A nail exploit negatively affects gameplay, as only the soldier has the ability now to blow up people through walls, even if they have no ammo. This is a One-sided exploit, and it only benefits a certain group of players(soldiers and whatever team they are on.) Hope that clearsthings up for you.

[o_sabre]

Originally Posted by Imbrifer

Anti-Bunnyhoppers: We don't like bunnyhopping because we don't like someone else moving around faster than us and upsetting the gameplay balance.
Bunnyhoppers: We like moving faster than others and upsetting their gameplay balance because it helps us do better.

Just so happens that the FF team is the latter. I hope that it isn't so weird that new players get frustrated by being killed by bunnyhoppers and leave the community.

I hope it can be toggled on servers.

I predict the game would have less people playing it if BH was removed.

[Jiggles]

Plus, you can overcome a good bhopper with skill. Overcoming a nail gren exploiter? I guess you could put most of your D away from places where grens could be imbedded, but that's almost the entire flag room on certain maps (like bases_r2 or well). You also could try and stop the grens from being imbedded, but that would also require a significant alteration of your D - way more than bhopping ever necessitated.

Among other reasons, I find bhopping fun because I like jumping around like a maniac. I did it well before bhopping was discovered and even in games where it provided zero benefit (WoW, for example). Maybe my mind has been warped by a youth hooked on Mario Bros, but I really do find it fun

[o_radio]

bunnylove here. there is no other game out there (atleast i can't think of any) that allows people to beat others with sheer movement while others frag. being able to do it kicks ass, not everyone wants to frag like mad. we are few but we exist.

[o_zaskar]

Originally Posted by yoda891

Sorry to rain on your parade with the nail exploit analogy, but just because something is an exploit doesn't make the same reasoning applicable to another exploit. It's like saying that cutting a rock is just as bad as cutting a human, because they are both solid objects. But we all know that they are not the same, because there is reasoning outside what they have in common that seperates them. 1- a human is a living thing 2- a human can feel pain, a rock has no feelings. The same reasoning I have here is applicable to your analogy. 1- bunnyhopping is available to all classes, offense and defence, so it will not have a negative impact on the balance of the game. 2- A nail exploit negatively affects gameplay, as only the soldier has the ability now to blow up people through walls, even if they have no ammo. This is a One-sided exploit, and it only benefits a certain group of players(soldiers and whatever team they are on.) Hope that clearsthings up for you.

And im the one thats bad at analogies? :P

You cant blow apart an analogy example by using another really bad analogy as an example trying to show that since that one is bad people should think mine is like that.

their bolth exploits, 1 is just in general liked by many (but not everyone, but to hell with those who dont like it, it must just be because they dont know how to do it right? yea that must be it) and the other is found to be annoying by many. Some servers argue that its allowed cause the nail nade has such limited usses as is (aside from getting sentry guns its not too good) and beyong able to get someone hiding in an above room with an explosive is kind of cool (i mean common a mini shock wave or gas goes right through walls but a explosion right next to one doesnt?) But then i guess that wasnt intendded in TFC, unlike the use of air accel to skip yourself off the ground gaining speed for some unknown reason every time you turn. and since we totally are goin by what valve said was intendded, arent teleporters the best thing ever? :P

BTW like i said i dont want it removed from the engine, id lose out all my Surf maps if they changed that, and me like the rest of you doesnt wa nt to lose out on a skill ive perfected that wasnt really intendded ;P

[o_tu!]

damn this thread was one of the gayest reads on this forum so far.

zaskeer and the rest of the anti-bhop crew...don't you newbs ever STFU?...you guys don't even know wtf you are talking about.

[o_sacred]

Don't forget (not sure if this has been posted already) FF will have a well planned, clear, easy to follow tutorial guiding newbies step by step through the technique of bunny-hopping.

So when they emerge into the FF world, they will at least have some idea what is going on :P




BTW FF: Please have a search option allowing to filter out bot servers. I know steam has the option to see which servers bots are on, but that isnt good enough!

[o_zaskar]

Originally Posted by tu!

damn this thread was one of the gayest reads on this forum so far.

zaskeer and the rest of the anti-bhop crew...don't you newbs ever STFU?...you guys don't even know wtf you are talking about.

LoL you love skimming parts of shit and then commenting dont you.

im not anti Bhop, all i said was it may scare off many new players. (unless their tutorial type thing goes very well) What i did also say was is that it was an exploit, not that i give a damn about that technicality though. But most dont seem to agree with that, which is kind of odd. Like admiting to themselves that their using whats technically an exploit would make them feel dirty or something.

only applies to games with air accel that diddnt intentonally want it, like FF is incorperating Bhopping as part of the game (much in the same way the exploit in Tribs one that let you ski down mountians got added as a feature in tribes 2) So soon it will be a moot point.

Also your a noob who in general is more annoying then me so its kind of ironic that your tellin me to stfu.

[o_zaskar]

Originally Posted by sacred

BTW FF: Please have a search option allowing to filter out bot servers. I know steam has the option to see which servers bots are on, but that isnt good enough!

The only way possible to do this is a forced by game naming convention i guess. Since the search function/window is not something they have any control over whatsoever :/ Thats 100% steams programming.

The bot filter is good but still a pain, everyone hats that HLTV crap takin 1 spot in servers nowadays and that sets off the bot filter.

And yea i hope the tutorial is awsome, so many times in TFC did people say people were "speed hacking" and then were told its part of the game. then they asked how and usually were just ignored or called a noob :P

usually making the 2-3 people in a pub who knew it just own face. (though it is kind of a PITA to explain i guess :/)

[o_zero]

BHop comes up every week over on the HL2CTF boards. We enabled it a few versions back (probably the same or a very similar to what FF has done) and this issue has divided people like nothing else. There are about 40-50 elite CTF/DM players that love bhopping and the rest of the players either can't stand it, think its cheating, or tolerate it (barely).

It's a very important issue and I hope it doesn't have the same negative impact on FF. If Valve decides not to allow bhop in TF2 (likely?), they may steal away a lot of the new-generation players who can't compete with the old school players.

[o_lucid]

I hope by natural you mean realistic. Even so, that is a no. Fortress forever is not a realistic game. It was originally part of the TFC game and wasn't taken out for a very long time. It's all about how the developers view and want the game. I am not aware of the bunny hopping function but it is possible there may be some balance to this. I think that bunny hopping is extremely fundamental to the game.

[o_radio]

Originally Posted by zero

There are about 40-50 elite CTF/DM players that love bhopping and the rest of the players either can't stand it, think its cheating, or tolerate it (barely).

i don't get it. why is it such a bad thing for people to try and learn something that deviates from the usual "i point, i click and he dies" cycle? especially in ctf since it's all about escaping with something that is not yours and not getting hit in the process.

[o_yoda891]

Originally Posted by Zaskar

And im the one thats bad at analogies? :P

You cant blow apart an analogy example by using another really bad analogy as an example trying to show that since that one is bad people should think mine is like that.

Why can't I. Sorry, but the Darkness arguement of "rong" isn't going to hold up much longer. Open up your narrow-minded view and look at the big picture. An exploit that poses no threat to the balance of gameplay and one that gives a one-sided advantage are not the same thing. You can't compare the two, at least the way you are trying to.

[o_zaskar]

Originally Posted by radio

i don't get it. why is it such a bad thing for people to try and learn something that deviates from the usual "i point, i click and he dies" cycle? especially in ctf since it's all about escaping with something that is not yours and not getting hit in the process.

I guess some people just dont like it :/ cant fault them for that, some people dont like HW's (espically more then 1) some dont like snipers, some hate infect meds, some hate teliporters, hell there are a million things people dont like about games, is it that hard to accept that people dont like that? Some people like teleporters, the oldschool TFC guys hate it. (i dont care, i wasnt a clan player) Who is right? Its all oppinion :/

[o_tu!]

Originally Posted by Zaskar

LoL you love skimming parts of shit and then commenting dont you.

im not anti Bhop, all i said was it may scare off many new players. (unless their tutorial type thing goes very well) What i did also say was is that it was an exploit, not that i give a damn about that technicality though. But most dont seem to agree with that, which is kind of odd. Like admiting to themselves that their using whats technically an exploit would make them feel dirty or something.

only applies to games with air accel that diddnt intentonally want it, like FF is incorperating Bhopping as part of the game (much in the same way the exploit in Tribs one that let you ski down mountians got added as a feature in tribes 2) So soon it will be a moot point.

Also your a noob who in general is more annoying then me so its kind of ironic that your tellin me to stfu.

no, i didn't skim anything...i guess all the fucked up anologies comparing tfc to weird games like wow etc and all the misinformation made me post about ure stupidity...

[Circuitous]

Okay, the only reference of any sort to WoW was Jiggles saying he loved jumping in every game he played, WoW included.

You so skimmed.

[o_zaskar]

Originally Posted by tu!

no, i didn't skim anything...i guess all the fucked up anologies comparing tfc to weird games like wow etc and all the misinformation made me post about ure stupidity...

Ahh ok that answers that question (your a moron with bad reading comprehension)

And Yoda im not complaining about Bhopping, just said its an exploit, and nail nading isnt imbalanced as bolth teams can do it.

Bhopping can be argues that it changes the balance of O and D. Which it unargueably does. Bhopping really isnt used by D (aside from some few instances of trying to chase down a flag carrier that just started) so how can you even talk about it not changing the balance.