Leveling the competition

[o_hypnotoad]

And how is conc jumping realistic? Airstrafing? I would like to see you throw some green thing behind you, which sends you in the air and then on midair, you turn in air and land back to position you started...comeon now.
ANY tf game IS NOT about realism, it takes skill to aim your rocket, aim your hitscan weapons, learn to aim conced and list just goes on and on....its not about some "metahuman". Like I sayd TF games are not bout realism and every TF game has had/have bhop, so should FF have it.
Saying it does looks stypid or its not realistic to bhop in TF games is just stypid imo.
Plus clangames would become just so BORING if you couldnt bhop, def would get so huge advatange if everyone is just forced to walk, that you hardly would see any caps.
Also theres dozens of tutorials all over net which explains you how to bhop and watching demos also helps bit...
When I started playing on 1,5 patch I never complained bout bhoppers and I once I got into my first "clan", first thing was to learn how to bhop (actually it was learn how to use irc but thats just other thing )
Anyway im bit off topic now but my point is bhop belongs to TF games period.

[o_shaggy]

I disagree with you hypnotoad. I believe TFC and halflife were based on real physics. The conc jump is very simple to explain. First off tfc weapons arent realistic to the weapons we use in real life. With that said they can create a device and say it does this, without really explaining why. But what we do know is the conc has a tossing effect. So using the conc to toss you does follow the laws of physics. Air strafing on the otherhand does not. So why no big fuss over air strafing. It's because it doesnt have such an overwhelming effect on the game as bh does. I use the term metahuman because although the engine was design to follow the simple laws of physics, it purposely made the human form stronger then actuality. If you want a reason sure i'll give you one; hl is based in the future and perhaps in the future we will be able to take more damage. That's besides the point.
The laws of physic were placed in the engine so that the environment would enteract with you just like in real life. Of course with any engine, nothing is perfect. So they had a few things they missed which we exploited to use for our advantage aka bhopping and straffe jump, but to be fair the engine was designed for a single person game without concs and what not. No one i know figured out bh or any other trick while playing HL. So my point being tfc was intended for you to react with the environment as you would in real life; we've just found flaws in their design and have used those flaws to give us an advantage. And because it takes tallent to harness the flaws in such a way to help the player, we now consider them skills and not exploits. Anyways, i think using the word stupid shows a lack of intelligence, perhaps you meant to say misinformed.

Furthermore perhaps you werent around in the old days before bh but the scores were just as high as today. If anything bh gave the o such an advantage that we've had to change from 8v8 to 9v9 for that one extra D.

[o_ivaqual]

i believe many people here intend "realistical" as "believable"

[o_player]

One of the main reasons people enjoy games is because they are not believable. Because nothing would be more boring than an ultra-realistic game where you died every second due to a pistol or shotgun blast to the chest, a grenade to the face, 50 or so bullets from a minigun or a rocket to the body.

Bunny Hopping is not realistic, or believable. That is why others and I like it. Because it looks unreal and that is what I want to see in games. Not movement systems and physics engines like Halo or Battle Field 1942.

TFC, Q3F and so on are unique, unreal and fast. That is why people enjoy them.

[o_binarylife]

You didn't just imply that Halo has realistic movement right?

He's a cyborg, and he jumps 10 feet in the air.

[o_ivaqual]

Originally Posted by Player

Not movement systems and physics engines like Halo

you obviously have never heard of grenade boosting

[o_player]

What I mean is the movements are horrible and stiff (my opinion). Jumping is rubbish because you can't jump jump jump, there is a slight pause and the basic movement like walking and strafing just feel wrong.

[o_sobe green]

How is jumping to increase your speed worse than jumping 10 feet in the air for no particular reason?

[o_comrade tiki]

Originally Posted by SoBe Green

How is jumping to increase your speed worse than jumping 10 feet in the air for no particular reason?

I'd rather have low-grav than bunnyhop. It's worse in my opinion. I'd prefer low gravity, where clever hiding on the rafters can save your life. I used to hide in the 2fort main enemy basement corridor years ago. On the 2Fort Low-Grav server, when everyone had an average ping of 350, including me. That was when cleverness mattered, instead of the ability to press a key at the right time. If you want to bunnyhop, I reccomend some of those dance dance and rhythm games, just not TFC. They're completely different, so why merge them on purpose to imitate a bug?

[o_ekim]

Some of us have love for DDR & TFC !

[o_flare]

Originally Posted by comrade tiki

I'd rather have low-grav than bunnyhop. It's worse in my opinion. I'd prefer low gravity, where clever hiding on the rafters can save your life. I used to hide in the 2fort main enemy basement corridor years ago. On the 2Fort Low-Grav server, when everyone had an average ping of 350, including me. That was when cleverness mattered, instead of the ability to press a key at the right time. If you want to bunnyhop, I reccomend some of those dance dance and rhythm games, just not TFC. They're completely different, so why merge them on purpose to imitate a bug?

so what you're implying is that bhoppers don't try and outwit their opponents, and are just mashing keys like a loon? and if bhop were taken out, they'd have to rely more on tactics like hiding in the rafters then player skill?

[o_comrade tiki]

Tactics are more fun than BH skills.

Would you rather run past a sniper, or land on his head with a crowbar?

I, for one, would love to see more creative players.

[o_ekim]

Creative as in refusing to learn a skill because it's an "exploit"?

[o_vanquish]

How are tactics more fun than bhop skills when they're one in the same?
Bhopping is a skill, and it is also a tactic used to gain speed and dodge enemy fire. Bhopping is actually far more creative than simply running around. Trying to find the fastest line through a room or yard required a lot of creativity. Heck, the patterns of your jumps require creativity. Finding ways to avoid obstacles while bhopping requires creativity.

I'd bet a lot of money that bhoppers are more creative as a whole than the anti-bhoppers who are stuck in one way and refuse to abide change.

For one I love bhopping to avoid the sniper, using the strafe and mouse movement and timing to pull off a sweet hh conc while still doding, THEN landing on his head and crowbarring him.

If you want examples of creativity go watch some of the clanners while they bhop. A lot of people will prime a conc before they pick up the grenbag in the 2fort respawn, bhop fast enough to jump off the battlements before it goes off, turn and toss the conc behind them and get propelled to the enemy battlesments, all while still having a full complement of concs. Tell me thats not creative. Speed allows more creativity as you can get things done faster and move places faster, allowing for some awesome double-concs, longer distance concs because your speed affects the distance your travel while concing, and many other things.

[o_voipme]

Originally Posted by comrade tiki

I'd rather have low-grav than bunnyhop. It's worse in my opinion. I'd prefer low gravity, where clever hiding on the rafters can save your life. I used to hide in the 2fort main enemy basement corridor years ago. On the 2Fort Low-Grav server, when everyone had an average ping of 350, including me. That was when cleverness mattered, instead of the ability to press a key at the right time. If you want to bunnyhop, I reccomend some of those dance dance and rhythm games, just not TFC. They're completely different, so why merge them on purpose to imitate a bug?

Technically, you can bunnyhop in low grav. The only reason bunnyhopping works is because of the acceleration from curving the mouse while strafing either direction. As you probably know, you can EASILY curve on low grav servers to get going extremely fast.

[o_comrade tiki]

Originally Posted by ekiM

Creative as in refusing to learn a skill because it's an "exploit"?

I didn't even mention my hate for repeating key pressing in that post which you so harshly responded to..

I meant that tactics are much more fun than runners.
I'd rather be killed by a crowbarist than watch an enemy run by, and I'd rather get a crowbar kill than run past the defense and get a capture in a pub.

It's just more fun.

[o_ekim]

So you don't try and achieve the objectives of the game?

[o_comrade tiki]

I said "in pub".

You know, public, where fun is the priority and a crowbar fight is commonplace among two bored players.
Stop attacking me in any way you can. You obviously have no defense if you're always on the offense, eh?

[o_ekim]

It's possible to have fun while actually trying to accomplish your objectives.

[o_comrade tiki]

I know. I've played TFC for years. I've captured many flags. I just don't run around like a loon whilst doing it...I actually fight the defense.
No more fun than getting two IC kills and capturing the flag.

Ok, enough chit-chat.