Pitchdown ?!

o_theniggy · 01-18-2005, 10:36 PM

Seeing as this is etac banned, is it going to be part of fortress forever ?

o_spud · 01-18-2005, 10:39 PM

Pitchdown being what?

The command to make your view look down or something?

o_theniggy · 01-18-2005, 10:44 PM

its sets how far down you can look when tilting your view down. Pitchup does the same for looking up. Command is cl_pitchdown in hl/hl2, and similar in other games (quake, ut etc.)

For tfc it allowed a sentry gun bug which meant it didn't lock on, and allowed a demoman to lay pipes at their feet. I'd assume that ff would fix the sg bug.

o_spud · 01-19-2005, 12:16 AM

Ah so,

Well the take from the team would be to fix any bugs that have been glaringly neglected by VALVe and more. We all want a glitch-free game.

o_rebo · 01-19-2005, 01:25 AM

Any SG tracking bug that appears in TFC wont appear in FF. However the current feeling is that pitchdown should be non-customizable. This doesnt preclude coding changes such as initial pipe and grenade aim angle.

Our philosophy for making pitchdown non customizable is that newer players should be able to accomplish any move or trick they see in the game with the required dedication, skill and effort to practise it. Tricks shouldnt rely on obscure cvars or file editing, which in the past have been a barrier for the skill progession of new players. c.f. _special scripts, tracers , chopping, and ax1.

We understand this will affect the 'long' rocket jump script, and will take that into account before finalizing the point.

o_hlstriker · 01-19-2005, 02:41 AM

What about FOV? Is that going to be non-changable?

o_thedarkone · 01-19-2005, 04:02 AM

Speaking of FOV, are you going to leave it at Hl2's 75, or go back to the 'classic' 90 degrees?

o_paddn ur stats · 01-19-2005, 05:06 AM

Are you going to allow 1st/3rd person camera angles or locked in 1st person ?

o_rebo · 01-19-2005, 06:21 AM

FOV will be changable. Default fov wont be 75.

3rd person will only be available speccing or when playing back demo's and such (for avi making etc) .

o_redbeard · 01-19-2005, 07:10 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by paddn ur stats

Are you going to allow 1st/3rd person camera angles or locked in 1st person ?

3rd person is cheating, unless of course it is readily available to everyone. However, it is considered cheating in TFC. Its almost like having a wallhack.

o_lenown · 01-19-2005, 07:51 AM

3rd person view isn't wallhack. so we you can see around walls and stuff big woppy. i used to have a 3rd person hack for TFC back before they brought all this new hack finding stuff. and i enjoyed it becuase it gave me a new outlook on the game and i thought it was funner to play in 3rd person then 1st all the time but thats me.

and btw redbeard 3rd person WAS accessable to everybody back when TFC first released but poeple was bitching its other form of a wallhack so they took the command out

o_rebo · 01-19-2005, 08:13 AM

Unfortunately Lenown, 3rd person was widely used by cheaters because it could let you see through walls and have no conc effect. Seeing thru walls is an advantage because you can see when people are comming, and no conc effect lets you shoot perfectly without sufffering from concussion.

o_hlstriker · 01-19-2005, 11:44 AM

Yeah, there did actually used to be a command in half-life and most of the mods that let you go 3rd person back in the day. Im glad they changed it though, 3rd person is pretty stupid if you ask me.... I mean come on, being able to turn the camera angel so you can see around a corner!!! How stupid

o_ekim · 01-19-2005, 12:19 PM

Quote:

3rd person view isn't wallhack. so what you can see around walls

Read that again and think...

Having played S&I clanned where the melee weapon (briefcase!) used a 3rd person camera, it was definately abused very much in clan matches to see around corners (mainly by me!).

Oh and as for the pitchdown issue.... I agree it should be locked, but I don't really have feelings either way as to whether vertical pipe placement should be possible. It's up to the development team to choose one I guess, and there won't be complaints of it being an "exploit" like there were in TFC, because either everyone will be able to do it or nobody will.

o_norris · 01-19-2005, 12:28 PM

Pitchdown/up is an good option for moviemakers and shouldn't be banned out of tfc/FF. Would be nice to customize the pitchdown value which sv_cheats 1 or something.

o_eat · 01-19-2005, 01:01 PM

Good point Norris.

o_paddn ur stats · 01-21-2005, 07:46 AM

I had heard a "back in the day" story that TFC allowed 3rd but i havent played it in ages. Ive become quite dependant on 3rd person from playing DAOC for the last 3 years, so 1st will take some readjusting for me again. Thanks for the answer.

o_mattous · 01-21-2005, 11:23 AM

I think that removal of any pitchdown etc commands is a very good idea, it's annoying that there are some many people that use the same scripts to rj, bunny hop and everything, aspecially when I and a lot of other people have had to practice hard at getting them right.

o_spud · 01-21-2005, 04:37 PM

Aye as its a useful command but prone to being abused I suggest making it a sv_cheats variable.

01-18-2005, 10:36 PM	#1
o_theniggy Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Pitchdown ?! Seeing as this is etac banned, is it going to be part of fortress forever ?

01-19-2005, 02:41 AM	#6
o_hlstriker Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Lancaster, Ohio Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	hmm What about FOV? Is that going to be non-changable?

01-19-2005, 05:06 AM	#8
o_paddn ur stats Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Evansville, IN Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	POV Camera angle Are you going to allow 1st/3rd person camera angles or locked in 1st person ?

01-19-2005, 07:51 AM	#11
o_lenown Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	3rd person 3rd person view isn't wallhack. so we you can see around walls and stuff big woppy. i used to have a 3rd person hack for TFC back before they brought all this new hack finding stuff. and i enjoyed it becuase it gave me a new outlook on the game and i thought it was funner to play in 3rd person then 1st all the time but thats me. and btw redbeard 3rd person WAS accessable to everybody back when TFC first released but poeple was bitching its other form of a wallhack so they took the command out

01-19-2005, 11:44 AM	#13
o_hlstriker Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Lancaster, Ohio Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	hmm Yeah, there did actually used to be a command in half-life and most of the mods that let you go 3rd person back in the day. Im glad they changed it though, 3rd person is pretty stupid if you ask me.... I mean come on, being able to turn the camera angel so you can see around a corner!!! How stupid

01-18-2005, 10:39 PM	#2
o_spud Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts Rated Helpful 1 Times	Pitchdown being what? The command to make your view look down or something?

01-18-2005, 10:44 PM	#3
o_theniggy Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	its sets how far down you can look when tilting your view down. Pitchup does the same for looking up. Command is cl_pitchdown in hl/hl2, and similar in other games (quake, ut etc.) For tfc it allowed a sentry gun bug which meant it didn't lock on, and allowed a demoman to lay pipes at their feet. I'd assume that ff would fix the sg bug.

01-19-2005, 12:16 AM	#4
o_spud Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts Rated Helpful 1 Times	Ah so, Well the take from the team would be to fix any bugs that have been glaringly neglected by VALVe and more. We all want a glitch-free game.

01-19-2005, 01:25 AM	#5
o_rebo Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts Rated Helpful 1 Times	Any SG tracking bug that appears in TFC wont appear in FF. However the current feeling is that pitchdown should be non-customizable. This doesnt preclude coding changes such as initial pipe and grenade aim angle. Our philosophy for making pitchdown non customizable is that newer players should be able to accomplish any move or trick they see in the game with the required dedication, skill and effort to practise it. Tricks shouldnt rely on obscure cvars or file editing, which in the past have been a barrier for the skill progession of new players. c.f. _special scripts, tracers , chopping, and ax1. We understand this will affect the 'long' rocket jump script, and will take that into account before finalizing the point.

01-19-2005, 04:02 AM	#7
o_thedarkone Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Quebec, Canada Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Speaking of FOV, are you going to leave it at Hl2's 75, or go back to the 'classic' 90 degrees?

01-19-2005, 06:21 AM	#9
o_rebo Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts Rated Helpful 1 Times	FOV will be changable. Default fov wont be 75. 3rd person will only be available speccing or when playing back demo's and such (for avi making etc) .

01-19-2005, 08:13 AM	#12
o_rebo Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts Rated Helpful 1 Times	Unfortunately Lenown, 3rd person was widely used by cheaters because it could let you see through walls and have no conc effect. Seeing thru walls is an advantage because you can see when people are comming, and no conc effect lets you shoot perfectly without sufffering from concussion.

01-19-2005, 12:28 PM	#15
o_norris Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Germany Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Pitchdown/up is an good option for moviemakers and shouldn't be banned out of tfc/FF. Would be nice to customize the pitchdown value which sv_cheats 1 or something.

01-19-2005, 01:01 PM	#16
o_eat Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Good point Norris.

01-21-2005, 07:46 AM	#17
o_paddn ur stats Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Evansville, IN Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	about the 3rd person I had heard a "back in the day" story that TFC allowed 3rd but i havent played it in ages. Ive become quite dependant on 3rd person from playing DAOC for the last 3 years, so 1st will take some readjusting for me again. Thanks for the answer.

01-21-2005, 11:23 AM	#18
o_mattous Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: England Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	I think that removal of any pitchdown etc commands is a very good idea, it's annoying that there are some many people that use the same scripts to rj, bunny hop and everything, aspecially when I and a lot of other people have had to practice hard at getting them right.

01-21-2005, 04:37 PM	#19
o_spud Join Date: Jan 2005 Posts Rated Helpful 1 Times	Aye as its a useful command but prone to being abused I suggest making it a sv_cheats variable.

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