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Old 11-21-2010, 07:13 PM   #81
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Originally Posted by Bridget View Post
Mad, nerd?



The beta tests don't introduce anything new. I don't want to test the same mechanics six months in a goddamn row, especially if nothing happens as a result. Taking part in the beta tests is nothing more than "Play Fortress Forever 2.5 before everyone else!" I don't feel like loading up the game just to test the same mechanic again and again in virtually the same form as it was months ago. Work on something new for once. You guys haven't touched the Engineer's gun in months. Maybe if there was actually something to test, I would give a shit.
lol case in point
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Old 11-21-2010, 07:17 PM   #82
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Originally Posted by Gwarsbane View Post
So Bridget doesn't play pubs or pugs or privately or even the beta
This is an irrelevant point. I have enough experience playing the game in the past to justify my opinion on it. It's even more trivial to fault me on not playing when the game hasn't been patched in a fucking year. I don't have to actively play Fortress Forever to retain my knowledge on it. What if I don't play Fortress Forever because of the points I argue, then it would be redundant to say I couldn't argue them because I don't play. Maybe you should go back to crying about people dismantling Sentry Guns, Gwars.

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he insults the dev team
Boo-fucking-hoo. The Development routinely insult(ed|s) the public community. In fact, one developer had the fucking audacity to insult zE, calling him stupid and incapable of contributing anything to this mod, despite the fact that zE has contributed more to this mod than said developer. I have had the discussions, where the implications were that the public audience was incompetent. You haven't had these discussions, Gwars, so what the fuck would you know?

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makes things up, twists things that have been said, actively trolls and causes problems on these forums.
What have I made up? If you know nothing, how can you conclude I make shit up? Twist what things that have been said? Show me an example. Actively trolls and causes problems? Oh, because I'm more critical of the development of this modification than other people? Because I have the balls to point out the developers couldn't manage a lemonaide stand much less a video game? Everyone wants to say it. In private, everyone agrees. No one will say it, though, and that reluctance makes me seem like a troll.

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He keeps making excuses for not playing. He doesn't want to play. Can't play because servers force a DX8 or DX9 standard to prevent cheating and claims his system can't handle it. (then he needs to spend 5 to 20 bucks on a DX9 (or higher) based card). Doesn't play the beta because it hardly changes.
It depends on the situation.

Do I want to play Fortress Forever for merely the game? No. I don't. The game merely by itself is not sufficient enough to entertain me or retain my interest.

Do I want to play Fortress Forever for the community? Yes, I enjoy playing the game when it's within the context of community. I loved pubbing on Talos. Unfortunately, I can't do that anymore due to the server enforcing mat_dxlevel 80, which crashes my computer. This crash results from my graphics card being fucked. I don't have a warranty anymore, and I don't have the cash to buy another. Unlike my old one, this one came fucked up, and I didn't want to waste the time and money sending it back. At that point, I wanted to take a break from gaming anyway, and figured I would take advantage of my warranty later down the line. I never did. My graphics card, if it weren't heavily underclocked to allow me to play, otherwise supports up DirectX10. Video cards aren't 5 to 20 bucks, either, 'tard.

Is beta testing playing for the community? Yes, it is. Hopefully, my input helps the development team fix their fucking game to make its actual audience happy. However, I don't test anymore. Why? It's futile. The developers are going to do their own thing regardless of the beta testers' opinions. No matter how many times you point out that what they're working on is unnecessary, they keep doing it. They keep working on dumb shit, all the while stuff that needs to be fixed sits half-worked on in the background. It's futile as fuck. In addition, the game doesn't change dramatically enough to justify testing all the time. If the developers think it does, then why do they constantly neglect the idea of a development blog on the basis that not enough work gets done? Which is it? Whatever benefits you at the time? C'mon, try harder.

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Blah blah blah
Nerd.
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Old 11-21-2010, 09:02 PM   #83
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A beta tester is not a developer. Please do not expect to have a clear voice into the design of the game or it's dynamics.
You should have read this before applying to the beta team. Now fuck off and die.

Last edited by moosh; 11-21-2010 at 09:03 PM.
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Old 11-21-2010, 09:18 PM   #84
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Then perhaps the developers should stop requesting the public to "get involved" when we complain that they broke something. If getting involved means we have little or no say in the matter, then suggesting the need to get involved is redundant and will change very little or nothing as a result. So, good try. Good try.
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Old 11-21-2010, 09:19 PM   #85
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Quote:
Because I have the balls to point out the developers couldn't manage a lemonaide stand much less a video game? Everyone wants to say it. In private, everyone agrees. No one will say it, though, and that reluctance makes me seem like a troll.
Finally. We've all been waiting for the always necessary Carlos Mencia-type. They are so important to society. Who cares if they say blatantly racist/untrue things? We were all thinking what he's saying! He's a truth teller! Nothings safe when Bridget Mencia is around, watch out! He ain't afraid to say it!
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Old 11-21-2010, 09:24 PM   #86
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bridget View Post
Then perhaps the developers should stop requesting the public to "get involved" when we complain that they broke something. If getting involved means we have little or no say in the matter, then suggesting the need to get involved is redundant and will change very little or nothing as a result. So, good try. Good try.
Here's the only thread on the beta forums in which you try to tell us to fix something gameplay-related in a way that we haven't tried or agreed with:

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Originally Posted by Bridget
These are the changes I would try to implement and balance. They're pretty radical and actually more about the class in general, so good luck sorting them out in your head. The first time I would do is completely rework the Sentry Gun so that it functioned as a support tool that wouldn't necessarily require interaction with the Engineer.

...
If you want to post the whole idea, go ahead. I just wanted to point out the fact that it's not a simple balance change. It's a complete rework that changes the role of the sentry gun, and it's not straightforward whether or not it'd be good or bad.

I don't understand where your frustration with the dev team stems from. I can't find examples where your ideas are ignored. For the most part, your thoughts line up with the devs'.
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Last edited by squeek.; 11-21-2010 at 09:26 PM.
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Old 11-21-2010, 09:32 PM   #87
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You should have read this before applying to the beta team. Now fuck off and die.
This is why theres a lot of dudes that chek this forum but never post or reply : p
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Old 11-21-2010, 09:37 PM   #88
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I just wanted to point out the fact that it's not a simple balance change. It's a complete rework that changes the role of the sentry gun, and it's not straightforward whether or not it'd be good or bad.
I realize it's not a simple balance change. If that's the case, though, why do you see just increasing push values and damage values as an option for 2.42? If it were that easy, why didn't you do that long ago? Again, I realize it's difficult to do, but not doing anything about it will get you nowhere. You guys are messing around with seemingly everything but the Sentry Gun in the beta. That's what annoys the hell out of me. The Sentry Gun, from my experience in pubs, is the crux of a good defense. Well, it sucks, so what do you think happens as a result?

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I don't understand where your frustration with the dev team stems from. I can't find examples where your ideas are ignored. For the most part, your thoughts line up with the devs'.
It began when I joined the beta team. Maybe I had high expectations, but I expected you guys to be steamrolling through problems. I figured you guys would be highly efficient. Then I did some tests, I didn't like some of the changes, and while I realized they weren't final and could change at any moment, I also realized that every minute spent on these changes was a removal of time that could have been spent on something I considered was more important, like the Sentry Gun. It never helped that you guys constantly told me that you couldn't do everything with limited time and resources. This just made it more unnerving when you guys weren't focusing on the Sentry Gun, because it felt your finite time and resources would eventually run up and nothing good for the SG would be left for show.
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Old 11-21-2010, 09:53 PM   #89
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We didn't change it in 2.41 because we buffed it in 2.4.

Steamrolling through problems is fine and dandy, but I think it should be obvious at this point that the SG is not all that great at being steamrolled.

Upping the push and damage is the closest to steamrolling a problem as we can get with the SG. All the other proposed solutions are reworkings, not strict balance changes, unless I'm missing something.
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Old 11-22-2010, 08:38 AM   #90
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Gwarsbane View Post
So Bridget doesn't play pubs or pugs or privately or even the beta, he insults the dev team, makes things up, twists things that have been said, actively trolls and causes problems on these forums.

He keeps making excuses for not playing. He doesn't want to play. Can't play because servers force a DX8 or DX9 standard to prevent cheating and claims his system can't handle it. (then he needs to spend 5 to 20 bucks on a DX9 (or higher) based card). Doesn't play the beta because it hardly changes.


I can understand why you wouldn't ban him (actually I can't), but remind me again why Bridget still has the beta tag?

Again with him having the beta tag he looks more official and people take him more seriously.
No offense, but this is a pretty fallacious argument, hardly a surprise coming from Gwarsbane, though. I don't agree with Bridget's approach, he's far too abrasive, but I still think he's fundamentally right. The devs do have a pretty lax attitude about making changes to the game transparent in order to swell public interest. Just because he doesn't play every day (I've seen him jump in the game multiple times in the past few weeks, because he's trying to create a payload gameplay variant, hardly evidence of him not giving a shit about the game) doesn't mean he can't have an opinion on the game, the beta process, etc. Playing the game everyday has no bearing on your ability to make an informed opinion--in fact I'd say it's the opposite. Someone who is devoted to playing the game in it's current state, and thus playing everyday, is someone who will be biased and will easily overlook the faults of the game. Someone who LIKES the game and the community, but finds the game needing massive changes to make it playable, or a new direction in the beta/dev process has a completely valid opinion.

Less paralogisms, people. Bridget's wrong in form, but not function. Most people can agree that he's most right about his grievances with the dev team, it's just the manor in which he goes about this which is off.
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Old 11-22-2010, 05:47 PM   #91
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Chef and i were discussing the sentry gun problem (or lack thereof) yesterday while waiting for people to start joining the beta server.. He had a very interesting idea in my opinion. We aren't even sure if this is doable or not but he said why couldn't we just use .lua somehow to make the sentry gun push and damage more powerful or less powerful for an avd game versus a ctf game? perhaps we could have a sitdown with chilled sanity about what he thinks needs done to make the sentry gun more efficient in an avd game, and have a sitdown with say someone like (any ctf pubber) on what they think needs done for sentry gun in a CTF game.. just an idea and i thought it was a good one. once again im pretty lost when it comes to what all lua is capable of but from what i understand you can do almost anything using lua. maybe fortress forever needs 2 different style sentry guns to fix the problems (i dont think this is needed, but it seems enough people do) just an idea dont jump me bridget please!!!

PS: can genghis tron make a post without using the word fallacy or fallacious? new favorite word or?? WHAT ARE YOU SPEAKING? GREEK?

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Old 11-22-2010, 06:06 PM   #92
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Originally Posted by CHURCHMOUTH View Post
Chef and i were discussing the sentry gun problem (or lack thereof) yesterday while waiting for people to start joining the beta server.. He had a very interesting idea in my opinion. We aren't even sure if this is doable or not but he said why couldn't we just use .lua somehow to make the sentry gun push and damage more powerful or less powerful for an avd game versus a ctf game? perhaps we could have a sitdown with chilled sanity about what he thinks needs done to make the sentry gun more efficient in an avd game, and have a sitdown with say someone like (any ctf pubber) on what they think needs done for sentry gun in a CTF game.. just an idea and i thought it was a good one. once again im pretty lost when it comes to what all lua is capable of but from what i understand you can do almost anything using lua. maybe fortress forever needs 2 different style sentry guns to fix the problems (i dont think this is needed, but it seems enough people do) just an idea dont jump me bridget please!!!

PS: can genghis tron make a post without using the word fallacy or fallacious? new favorite word or?? WHAT ARE YOU SPEAKING? GREEK?
Problem with that is, then every server could have different SG Values, confusing players. It's the reason why there isn't a ROF Lua for the RPG.
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Old 11-22-2010, 06:07 PM   #93
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All classes need to go back to 1.0 status. Get rid of jump pad and all the other gimmick stuff stick to straight up old tfc style play.
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Old 11-22-2010, 06:08 PM   #94
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Two Sentry Gun configurations isn't a good idea because of how inconsistent it is. It's hard enough for a beginner learning how to maintain the current gun. Can you imagine his confusion when his gun's stats change from his time on 2fort to his time on avanti? Can you imagine how frustrated he would be having to apply different approaches to his gun depending on the current game-mode? The ideal solution is finding something that works in both CTF and AVD.
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Old 11-22-2010, 06:25 PM   #95
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The SG sucks. That doesn't make it OK to attack the dev team, more so with false assumptions
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:06 PM   #96
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Two Sentry Gun configurations isn't a good idea because of how inconsistent it is. It's hard enough for a beginner learning how to maintain the current gun. Can you imagine his confusion when his gun's stats change from his time on 2fort to his time on avanti? Can you imagine how frustrated he would be having to apply different approaches to his gun depending on the current game-mode? The ideal solution is finding something that works in both CTF and AVD.
Wait a sec.... you DO have to apply different approaches to the SG depending on the current game mode, and even depending on which map. I don't think anyone believes the SG should be a "set it and forget it" killing machine, but it SHOULD be able to be effective against any class if set properly. That brings teamwork and strategy into play. I do agree that it should work across all game modes. However, it should be easy to take down if placed out in the open(where you can fire on it from outside it's own range), than if it's in a spot that gives the SG the advantage.
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:18 PM   #97
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All classes need to go back to 1.0 status. Get rid of jump pad and all the other gimmick stuff stick to straight up old tfc style play.
We think we have a solution to the jump pad in 2.42. The changes are going in... I just hope it works as planned
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:37 PM   #98
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And Dexter set up a linux build environment.
ff_traini... = ff_training????
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:03 PM   #99
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Yes, that isn't something new.
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Old 11-22-2010, 10:56 PM   #100
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is anyone interested in doing the job?
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