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Old 03-03-2012, 02:39 PM   #21
KubeDawg
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I am interested in making a team if anyone would like to join. I'm certainly not the best FF has to offer, but I think this will be fun anyhow and it'll be interesting to see how 3v3 works out.

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Old 03-04-2012, 05:25 PM   #22
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inb4 the following maps result in bad games which will make people think this league sucks:

openfire
congestus
r123
aardvark
highflag

Not disrespecting any maps necissarily, they just won't work for 3v.
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Old 03-04-2012, 05:38 PM   #23
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Originally Posted by the_cake View Post
inb4 the following maps result in bad games which will make people think this league sucks:

openfire
congestus
r123
aardvark
highflag

Not disrespecting any maps necissarily, they just won't work for 3v.
Whats wrong with openfire?
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Old 03-04-2012, 05:48 PM   #24
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Not gonna start an openfire debate, but the short answer is it's an attrition problem.

The offense is able to get to the base and flagroom faster than the defense can reload rockets and pipes/respawn/set up sgs, whatever else. This is why it's always a spam fest in 4v4. The D just ends up dying over and over from the constant barrage of nades and throwing their own nades back at the O or on the flag after respawning.

As a general rule, 3v3 as a format increases offensive attrition by about 1/3. The reason for this is a 3 man D is inherently weaker than a 4 man D, since you have to either have only 1 frontline to cover 2 or more entrances, or no SG which puts a huge load on the demo. Any map that is "o heavy" in a 4v4 is going to be worse in a 3v3.

For this reason it becomes an even bigger spam fest in 3v3.

Conversely, "D friendly" maps will usually play better for this same reason.

Last edited by the_cake; 03-04-2012 at 05:49 PM.
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Old 03-04-2012, 09:13 PM   #25
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Motherfucker, I love openfire. To deny that as a map in the league is like denying a hippie his drugs and then giving him a haircut and deodorant.

I doubt ofire has been tested much with the 3v3 format, and aardvark as well. I vote for keeping ofire AND aardvark.

congestednuts and r123 though, they can be completely removed from FF for all I care.
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Old 03-04-2012, 10:31 PM   #26
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I never understood why this game always has to be defense favored, since tfc the defense has always been forced to have the advantage
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Old 03-05-2012, 09:53 AM   #27
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btw there's a team for ringers with no join key.
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Old 03-05-2012, 03:29 PM   #28
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how come some of the best players end up teaming up together? Does being one of the best, and teaming up with people who are not on your calibur make it not fun? What about a group of people who aren't at that calibur of skill? Are they suppose to team up and just not have any fun at all? Who has fun getting their ass wooped all the time? (prim example in pickups when people get pissy when they dont like the teams, or go on a rant about the loss, which we all do.)

And the actual rules are really strict. What is the definition for "fun" when it comes to this league?

I hate to be the one to break it, but even if you had a team that tried their hardest, against a team that didn't need to try, where's the fun in that? It's pretty one-sided.

This is going to shape up to be more competitive then it shouldn't be, for less experienced teams, and more of a joke for the more experienced teams.

Kind of would like to see more balance tbh.

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Old 03-05-2012, 06:01 PM   #29
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While I would like to see a more balanced distribution of the better players. I ALWAYS have fun. Even most of the times I get bitched at I have fun. (you gotta like, nag me non stop to take the fun out of it for me.)

A challenge is something I look forward to, and that's how you get better.
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Old 03-05-2012, 08:21 PM   #30
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While I would like to see a more balanced distribution of the better players. I ALWAYS have fun. Even most of the times I get bitched at I have fun. (you gotta like, nag me non stop to take the fun out of it for me.)

A challenge is something I look forward to, and that's how you get better.
Word.
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Old 03-05-2012, 10:16 PM   #31
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Quote:
Originally Posted by eomoyaff View Post
how come some of the best players end up teaming up together? Does being one of the best, and teaming up with people who are not on your calibur make it not fun? What about a group of people who aren't at that calibur of skill? Are they suppose to team up and just not have any fun at all? Who has fun getting their ass wooped all the time? (prim example in pickups when people get pissy when they dont like the teams, or go on a rant about the loss, which we all do.)

And the actual rules are really strict. What is the definition for "fun" when it comes to this league?

I hate to be the one to break it, but even if you had a team that tried their hardest, against a team that didn't need to try, where's the fun in that? It's pretty one-sided.

This is going to shape up to be more competitive then it shouldn't be, for less experienced teams, and more of a joke for the more experienced teams.

Kind of would like to see more balance tbh.
For the most part, skill is determined by the amount of time you've played the game. It's not surprising that the best players are most familiar with other good players, as those are the people they've spent the most time with, and, I can't speak for everyone, but usually people team up with who they like (or at the very least know). Artificially splitting up teams and making 3 relative strangers play with eachother against a team of 3 other strangers in the name of balance is not really what a league is about (at all), but is EXACTLY what pickups are about.

The moral here is: team up with people that you will HAVE FUN playing with; people that you know and like. It's the best recipe for success. However, if you want only even(ish) matches, then play pickups.

P.S. The rules at this point are just carried over from the 4v4 league as a placeholder. They'll probably change. What parts of the rules do you disagree with?

EDIT: Upon looking over the rules again, I'm totally confused about why you'd say that. Seemingly totally reasonable class restrictions are the only real "strictness" included.
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Old 03-06-2012, 12:38 AM   #32
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Why don't we have a league that has a certain amount of teams, each team consisting of 1 captain, then have each captain select their team from a pool of players, similarly to how pickups work.

Then each new week, the captains get together and pick from another pool of players.

That way you get a completely balanced approach to the league every week.

I agree it sucks going up against a team that has great players, but I also believe if you don't ever fight against someone that is more skilled than you, then you never improve your own skill. Still, a balanced approach might be better if you want the league to have more success.
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Old 03-06-2012, 12:41 AM   #33
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It doesn't suck going up against great players if you have fun playing with your teammates. Try to focus on doing that. NeoNL and I lost almost every one of our 2v2 matches in the old 2v2 league, but we still had fun.

Also, Kube, that'd just be a weekly pickup tournament. I don't see the benefit of that over just playing regular pickups.
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Old 03-06-2012, 12:49 AM   #34
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Quote:
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It doesn't suck going up against great players if you have fun playing with your teammates. Try to focus on doing that. NeoNL and I lost almost every one of our 2v2 matches in the old 2v2 league, but we still had fun.

Also, Kube, that'd just be a weekly pickup tournament. I don't see the benefit of that over just playing regular pickups.
Oh boy yes we did, http://www.ffpickup.com/league/natwov/mustache_brigade to prove it. I can't say there was any match that we didn't have fun with. Sure leagues are all about winning, since you are playing with a set group of people. In all honesty though, winning doesnt mean everything, you can have fun by just playing. A great quote by FDA:
Quote:
I ALWAYS have fun. Even most of the times I get bitched at I have fun.
. That is coming from someone who just started playing FF Pickups recently and still gets bitched at. Does he care? Not at all he plays to have fun.

I guess overall it comes to everyone's different mentalities. Some prefer winning and that's the only way they'll have fun. Some can just play and despite outcome they will have fun.

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Old 03-06-2012, 02:36 AM   #35
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Oh boy yes we did, http://www.ffpickup.com/league/natwov/mustache_brigade to prove it. I can't say there was any match that we didn't have fun with. Sure leagues are all about winning, since you are playing with a set group of people. In all honesty though, winning doesnt mean everything, you can have fun by just playing. A great quote by FDA: . That is coming from someone who just started playing FF Pickups recently and still gets bitched at. Does he care? Not at all he plays to have fun.

I guess overall it comes to everyone's different mentalities. Some prefer winning and that's the only way they'll have fun. Some can just play and despite outcome they will have fun.
Squeek only covered half of my points, meaning all the answers aren't there, suggestively making my point valid.

As for what you stated neon, It's very true about differince in mentalities. Sure FDA still has fun, but that's him. He doesn't speak for everyone. There's about 2 other players in this league who probably have that same mind set.

I personally would like to win some. I know for a fact that I wont be able to do that if I pick up players who aren't on par with 90% of the teams on here. It won't even be close. That's my arguement.

@kube
I'd like to add that I face people better then me everytime I pickup. And a player can only be soo good. That's why I seek more fairness. Because I know that in my ability to get better, there will be a point in which I can't go any futher, and even with that, there will be players who can roll me.

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Old 03-06-2012, 02:42 AM   #36
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Speaking for myself, not my team, I plan on getting obliterated on a regular basis by players more skilled than myself. I will also conc myself into immovable objects, throw the flag into the worst possible spot, vaporize myself in the security lasers,etc.

And I am going to be laughing my ass off the entire time.
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Old 03-06-2012, 02:43 AM   #37
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Speaking for myself, not my team, I plan on getting obliterated on a regular basis by players more skilled than myself. I will also conc myself into immovable objects, throw the flag into the worst possible spot, vaporize myself in the security lasers,etc.

And I am going to be laughing my ass off the entire time.
And again that's your mentality. I've hit that point in which it was all for fun, but after a while it becomes a dull excuse for not winning. Thus why I'd enjoy winning some, so it remain fun for me.
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Old 03-06-2012, 05:32 AM   #38
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moya, i heard team bad is recruiting..
...
..
..
..
ROFOZROZLRFOLZOLFZOLFOZOLRFOZ
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Old 03-06-2012, 05:42 AM   #39
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hey sexy
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Old 03-06-2012, 06:50 AM   #40
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Ignore this post.

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