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Old 09-19-2007, 02:49 AM   #1
greenday5494
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my fears have come true.

theres only about 63 servers with people actually in it. for about 3-4 it was livley. now its dead.
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:52 AM   #2
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Your fears ? TF2 Beta is going to end, people are going to come back because apparently the general consensus is that it's crap.
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:53 AM   #3
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and this is only the first release dude.

and also TF2 just came out.
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Old 09-19-2007, 02:59 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Suite307
Your fears ? TF2 Beta is going to end, people are going to come back because apparently the general consensus is that it's crap.
Perhaps its the general consensus around here, but I know tons of people, including myself, are absolutely loving TF2.
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Old 09-19-2007, 03:02 AM   #5
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General consensus is that it's crap? Where are you getting that? Let me guess, random internet forums? On the first day of release non-the-less?

I cannot tell you how many words of hatred I read about FF on random forums. I guess the general consensus is that FF is crap as well, huh?

Let's face it, every new game [especially hugely hyped games], no matter how good they are, will get flamed by anonymous forum geeks. The MAJORITY, who are in game enjoying it, are not posting about it. That's usually how it works.

I cannot tell you how much praise I've been seeing (and hearing) in random public servers. The *TRUE* general consensus is that the game is f*cking awesome, and the fact that almost every single server is packed and the sheer number of servers are growing exponentially only further proves this.
 


Old 09-19-2007, 03:06 AM   #6
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umm, for everyone I've talked to ingame says it is horrible

Also, it will only be amazing for pubmasters, and it will never get farther then that =[
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Old 09-19-2007, 03:09 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaguax
General consensus is that it's crap? Where are you getting that? Let me guess, random internet forums? On the first day of release non-the-less?

I cannot tell you how many words of hatred I read about FF on random forums. I guess the general consensus is that FF is crap as well, huh?

Let's face it, every new game [especially hugely hyped games], no matter how good they are, will get flamed by anonymous forum geeks. The MAJORITY, who are in game enjoying it, are not posting about it. That's usually how it works.

I cannot tell you how much praise I've been seeing (and hearing) in random public servers. The *TRUE* general consensus is that the game is f*cking awesome, and the fact that almost every single server is packed and the sheer number of servers are growing exponentially only further proves this.
That doesn't PROVE anything. Valve has a far bigger following. They have more advertising and marketing capability. FF can't run around saying "FROM THE MAKERS OF TFC" but Valve can. FF can't run around boasting a professionally developed game from a longstanding company but Valve can.

You also fail to understand the disappointment on this forum. TF2 primarily appeals to a mass audience, and not to the hardcore gamers that have cherished TFC and the like.

As a game, I'm sure TF2 is a huge hit. As a sequel to a classic franchise? It's a disappointment...
 


Old 09-19-2007, 03:11 AM   #8
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And how many, out of thousands, have you talked to in game that said it's horrible?

Even if you talked with 100 people [which you didn't], that would only be 100 out of thousands and your argument goes right down the drain.

Trust me dude, people who are enjoying TF2 FAAARR outweigh the people who think it's horrible.

But this forum is a horrible place for TF2 opinions, can you say biased?
 


Old 09-19-2007, 03:20 AM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jaguax
And how many, out of thousands, have you talked to in game that said it's horrible?

Even if you talked with 100 people [which you didn't], that would only be 100 out of thousands and your argument goes right down the drain.

Trust me dude, people who are enjoying TF2 FAAARR outweigh the people who think it's horrible.

But this forum is a horrible place for TF2 opinions, can you say biased?
So people who have barely (if at all) played TFC (or FF) are unbiased?

If TF2 is all they really have a taste of, they cannot reach the level of comparison that is on this board.

It would be incredibly difficult, but if you took a poll with everyone who has had an adequately long experience with TFC, FF, and TF2, I wonder what the general consensus would be.
 


Old 09-19-2007, 03:27 AM   #10
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krylon
So people who have barely (if at all) played TFC (or FF) are unbiased?
And this right here is a perfect example of the problem.

In fact, people who have barely (if at all) played TFC (or FF) are the most unbiased people you'll find with regards to TF2.

Unbiased means objective, objective means having no prior preference or opinion or expectation, meaning you take everything as you see it, rather than comparing it to whatever expectations you created on your own.

Those are the people to best give TF2 whatever criticisms it deserves. Valve did not set any expectations for TF2. They kept the actual gameplay of it extremely hush hush for that very reason.

Are you going to blame them for making a different game?

Some people take franchises too seriously. "This is hardly a TF game."

What defines a TF game? Who really cares what defines it anyway? So far I have loved every one of the Fortress mods/games, including TF2 and FF.

The problem is that everyone here has their own little bubble of expectations and any deviation is absolutely ATROCIOUS.
 


Old 09-19-2007, 03:32 AM   #11
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Well I'm preordering the Orange box friday, so I'll say my honest, unbiased thoughts.

I may have played alot of FF and TFC, but I can clear my thoughts about those and go into TF2 with a clear head.
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Old 09-19-2007, 03:34 AM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Apathy
umm, for everyone I've talked to ingame says it is horrible

Also, it will only be amazing for pubmasters, and it will never get farther then that =[
and getting farther than that is...? pro-cyber athlete making millions? isn't the point of any game to have fun? what if they have fun playing only in public servers? there's absolutely nothing wrong with being a "pubmaster." playing in a clan doesn't make you any "more better" than some one who pubs and plays the game. at any rate, there is potential for organized clan base games in both TF2 and FF.

i've played TFC since 1998. i've played both FF and TF2. both are great but are for two different types of gamers.

reguardless this is all null because it's all opinions.

there is no definite FF is better than TF2 or vise versa.

btw, TF2 fucking rocks.
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Old 09-19-2007, 03:34 AM   #13
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From another post i put up:

But more to the point, if you were to list the machanics that made team fortress style gaming into what's known as team fortress style gaming, you end up with more than:

1. diversity of classes
2. capture <whatever>

Because Dod, or Bf2, or <insert game> all fall under this category.

What made team fortress into team fortress has much to do with how the game physics were pushed to the limit by use of weapons, grenades, environment, whatever is available, according as the class weapons allowed, game physics allowed, map environment allowed, etc. and developed into the intricate gameplay depth such as concing, double concing, bhop, rocket/pipe jump, etc etc

Some one had mentioned this in another post, but instead of giving it the name "Team fortress 2," which suggests that it's an extention of the original team fortress style of gaming, valve could have named it something like "Valve's FPS 2" and change the skins and weapon models to something non-tf like, which would then throw off the impression of a tf type of gaming, and instead put it in the realm of "other fps."

So it seems that valve tagged on the name "team fortress 2" as a marketing ploy to sell their games. As such, if their marketing ploy backfires because it doesn't turn-out to be the team fortress type of gaming that the name suggests, then valve rightly deserves criticism from comparison by those who are familiar with the team fortress style of gamplay.

If BF2 used tfc skin models, used tfc weapon hud, and called it "New Team Fortress," they would be under the same kind of scrutiny and compared to other games that claim to have its tf gaming style.

People have already said that tf2 plays like css or dods. That's a hint that the core style of gaming that is claimed as team-fortress like, is very very weak, in terms of it's team fortress style of gameplay. Just imagine it with dod or cs skin, with dod or cs weapon hud models, and can tf2 be called dods2? or css for beginners? and still make you think, hmmm tf2 does seem more simillar to those games than tfc or tf 1.5, or its tf predecesors?

With ff, even if you were use other skins or weapons models, the gameplay has that team fortress feel to it, the rapid pace, the gren/rocket jump combo, in addition to class/weapon division/enhancement, etc which is probably what the dev team were trying to aim for.
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Old 09-19-2007, 03:37 AM   #14
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There will always be differences

I honestly don't think ANYONE can say which is better and which is crap. If you like FF, awesome, play it and have fun. If you like TF2, awesome, play it and have fun. If you like TFC, awesome, play it and have fun.

Don't come bitching about the other game. It's just like how some people prefer playing strategy games, but someone likes first person shooters. We all have different tastes and styles, so please don't bash on someone else's tastes. It's just childish to do so.

GG

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Old 09-19-2007, 03:39 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BillyPilgrim
I honestly don't think ANYONE can say which is better and which is crap. If you like FF, awesome, play it and have fun. If you like TF2, awesome, play it and have fun. If you like TFC, awesome, play it and have fun.

Don't come bitching about the other game. It's just like how some people prefer playing strategy games, but someone likes first person shooters. We all have different tastes and styles, so please don't bash on someone else's tastes. It's just childish to do so.

GG

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Old 09-19-2007, 03:39 AM   #16
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I've just been gauging it by how we're doing compared to other mods (like gmod) and the number of players relative to them. Right now FF is still keeping pace with a lot of the games that had similar numbers in the days following the release.

TF2 has come and, as expected, people are checking it out. Lots of the FF devs are playing it as well, so it's only to be expected.

We'll have a better idea of where we are in a couple of weeks and a patch or two down the line.
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Old 09-19-2007, 03:40 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kao
And this right here is a perfect example of the problem.

In fact, people who have barely (if at all) played TFC (or FF) are the most unbiased people you'll find with regards to TF2.

Unbiased means objective, objective means having no prior preference or opinion or expectation, meaning you take everything as you see it, rather than comparing it to whatever expectations you created on your own.

Those are the people to best give TF2 whatever criticisms it deserves. Valve did not set any expectations for TF2. They kept the actual gameplay of it extremely hush hush for that very reason.

Are you going to blame them for making a different game?

Some people take franchises too seriously. "This is hardly a TF game."

What defines a TF game? Who really cares what defines it anyway? So far I have loved every one of the Fortress mods/games, including TF2 and FF.

The problem is that everyone here has their own little bubble of expectations and any deviation is absolutely ATROCIOUS.
DING DING DING DING, we have a winner! The above is an example of a good, UNBIASED post.
 


Old 09-19-2007, 04:22 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kao
And this right here is a perfect example of the problem.

In fact, people who have barely (if at all) played TFC (or FF) are the most unbiased people you'll find with regards to TF2.

Unbiased means objective, objective means having no prior preference or opinion or expectation, meaning you take everything as you see it, rather than comparing it to whatever expectations you created on your own.

Those are the people to best give TF2 whatever criticisms it deserves. Valve did not set any expectations for TF2. They kept the actual gameplay of it extremely hush hush for that very reason.

Are you going to blame them for making a different game?

Some people take franchises too seriously. "This is hardly a TF game."

What defines a TF game? Who really cares what defines it anyway? So far I have loved every one of the Fortress mods/games, including TF2 and FF.

The problem is that everyone here has their own little bubble of expectations and any deviation is absolutely ATROCIOUS.
Well opinion is subjective in the first place, so I have no idea what you're trying to pull. Welcome to Earth, humans are biased.

Let's see if all 6+ billion people in the world think that TF2 is a great game. Go on. Do it. They're all "unbiased" right? I wanna see whether they're all going to invest their time in playing TF2.

You can't form a justifiable opinion without comparison in this situation. It's like trying to create a scientific law after one experiment. You're just trying to be a smart-alec by screaming "BIAS!" as soon as someone favors FF over TF2. Most people here that have done so have actually justified their opinion. I don't speak for everyone though.

I have seen VERY FEW posts about TF2 being good that have actually used a comparison to TFC and FF, and provided a valid reason. And you know what, for those posters, good for them. They like TF2 better. At least they can distinguish the two games. You're trying to isolate a group that has no basis of comparison.
 


Old 09-19-2007, 04:29 AM   #19
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hmm my question that remains un-answered , why o why do people that have a hardon for tf2 show up in the ff forum ? i know its related but damn... go rant and rave on there forums for a while and give us all a break already
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Old 09-19-2007, 05:23 AM   #20
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tf clanners/ex clanners = most will not enjoy it if they are hardcore tf'ers
average joe noob that never played tfx = will see pretty gfx and play it

average joe noob out numbers hardcore tf'ers...not rocket science ppl.
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