Is it me and/or my hardware or are LCDs inferior to CRTs

Paft · 03-08-2009, 12:43 AM

I suppose you don't really give a shit and this is maybe tl;dr material but I feel like posting it.

So I got myself this LG L226WTQ-PF monitor just under this time last year (it had a grey frame) and straight out of the box it had major ghosting problems, seen

YouTube

Pay attention to the gun on the ground, see how it has a green-white glow around when he moves. That is not the poor quality video that is the ghosting. Bad isn't it. Not just green-white glow, you also get various colours and shadowing.

So after having fucked off the monitor off for almost 12months (guarantee runs out mid next month), I finally last week got round to contacting LG, and they sent me a replacement no trouble at all, which seemed great. Same model of course only it's black. Same thing, major ghosting. So now realizing it wasn't a fault, it was google time.

I learnt there is a supposed "fix" and that it is "bad firmware configuration", which is also mentioned in the comments of that vid.

The "fix" does indeed seem to have worked but what I also didn't mention is motion blur.

I put the family's standard 1504fp dell 15" with the LG side by side and firstly tested them individually at the best matching res and refresh rate they are capable of. Both suffer from motion blur, and to be truthful asides from the LG being much more vibrant,performance wise in-game it's identically "poor" in my eyes.

Next I tested them in 'Clone' mode which means same display on both screens (matching res and refresh rate), not to be confused with screen spanning. Perform just the same as one another.

Set at 1024 x 768 --75 Hz in-game and out.

Still unconvinced it isn't just me, and unsatisfied I got out an old CRT Dell m770 17" and plonked that next to the LG, loaded up TFC for the 10th time, and WOW performance wise the CRT is completely motion blur free, preforms like a dream. The LCDs make my eyes go funny and generally just looks so bad that I cannot play well.

I don't know where to go with the post and how to finish it 'cause I'm tired and it's late, but I am lead to believe that LCDs are inferior to CRTs and though my eyes it is vastly inferior.

^BS
That is actually how the LG looks on the left and the one on the right being this CRT.

Innoc · 03-08-2009, 01:11 AM

I can't play on LCD's. I keep waiting for generation that provides CRT equivalent color (I believe that the max in color reproduction for LCD is like 70%) and performance without being super expensive. I've tried various Samsung's, Viewsonics, ACER, ASUS, LG and Dell's over the years...no dice. Even those that were claimed to be high performance and quick response...weren't. We've been hearing about OLED and LED backlit LCD and other technologies coming for years...but still nothing. I suspect that the economic downturn will only hurt the advancement for this.

PartialSchism · 03-08-2009, 03:00 AM

This is the type of thing that keeps me away from LCD or any other monitor. Im still using a factory Dell CRT that works great. I don't wanna lose any performance / visuals because some flat monitor takes up less space on my desktop, and gives me a bigger picture.

Shadow00Caster · 03-08-2009, 05:51 AM

I had budunkadunk-butt monitors for years before I finally switched to lcd's. My problem is that one, no lcd could support the resolutions I use on my crts, 2, I could see the slightest ghosting and everything else, 3, the viewing angles.

It took me 7 years to find lcd's that I found to be up to par with my specific needs .. and my crt's were dying and making funny noises =x.

I ended up spending 1500 on 2 24" asus lcd's .. it has always been that no lcd would replace my crt's and the ones that did cost waaaaay to much.

Innoc · 03-08-2009, 06:01 AM

I just had a terrible thought....I wonder if we'll fondly remember CRT's some day within the "they just don't make them like that anymore" vein...we're eventually forced to LCD only and the technology to make them work well for everyone never becomes reasonably priced....ugh...

KubeDawg · 03-08-2009, 07:53 AM

The only time I noticed a difference between my CRT and my LCD widescreen was for a few days after I installed it. It has a 5ms response time, and I really don't notice any difference, in fact, it's often clearer than a CRT.

Agent Buckshot Moose · 03-08-2009, 06:27 PM

My LCD has a 2ms response time. You need to find something 5 or lower if you want to use it for gaming without suffering ghosting problems.

Innoc · 03-08-2009, 06:51 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Agent Buckshot Moose

My LCD has a 2ms response time. You need to find something 5 or lower if you want to use it for gaming without suffering ghosting problems.

The problem is there is no standard for how that's measured. Even those with the claimed 2ms time have not performed as promised. Perhaps there are models out there that do deliver...I, for one, will continue to wait for the next generation.

MonoXideAtWork · 03-11-2009, 01:28 PM

anyone used a 120hz lcd for gaming?

Icculus · 03-11-2009, 04:09 PM

I have a Dell 19" LCD that I use for gaming. I'm used to it now but the CRT definitely gave a better picture.

Mooga · 03-11-2009, 05:59 PM

I actually find the colors on LCDs BETTER my old CRT. And I'm not using anything special, just used Hand-Me-Down LCDs...

Agent Buckshot Moose · 03-11-2009, 08:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Innoc

The problem is there is no standard for how that's measured. Even those with the claimed 2ms time have not performed as promised. Perhaps there are models out there that do deliver...I, for one, will continue to wait for the next generation.

Eh I have a Samsung 930B 19" 4:3 aspect ratio 2ms monitor. It works fine for me. I don't notice ghosting at all on it.

Zatoichi · 03-12-2009, 03:18 AM

i went from a crt to a dell 2001fp 1600x1200 20.5" with 8ms response time and had no ghosting. whenever i chose either a tv or monitor i look at a variety, with different content on them. a lot of people laughed when heard i bought a vizio 47" 1080p lcd tv, but they stop after they see it..its not one of the cutting edge 120hz tv's but its smooth in fast action, bright, with a great viewing angle, just a great picture. same thing goes for the samsung t260hd monitor i just bought a month ago, i compared image quality and size along with how they handled different content. the response time is great, no ghosting. and even though its a 6 bit tn panel, whatever dithering they use works great. this doubles as an hdtv as well, has a built in tuner. covers in the high 80's for ntsc color gamut, not bad for a "cheap" 26" monitor.

Skanky Butterpuss · 03-12-2009, 05:33 AM

not many people who know shit about tvs nowadays will laugh at a vizio. they are definitely the best budget brand out there, and their performance is damn good for the price. i got a samsung ln32a450, which has a 5ms response time, and i havent noticed ghosting on it at all. but, crts are always superior to lcds when it comes to that aspect, there is no doubt about that. for me, though, the convenience of a flat panel lcd far outweighs the nigh unnoticeable improvement in picture.

noeffeks · 03-13-2009, 08:20 AM

that and lcd's dont hurt my eyes.

BinaryLife · 03-13-2009, 02:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Zatoichi

i went from a crt to a dell 2001fp 1600x1200 20.5" with 8ms response time and had no ghosting. whenever i chose either a tv or monitor i look at a variety, with different content on them. a lot of people laughed when heard i bought a vizio 47" 1080p lcd tv, but they stop after they see it..its not one of the cutting edge 120hz tv's but its smooth in fast action, bright, with a great viewing angle, just a great picture. same thing goes for the samsung t260hd monitor i just bought a month ago, i compared image quality and size along with how they handled different content. the response time is great, no ghosting. and even though its a 6 bit tn panel, whatever dithering they use works great. this doubles as an hdtv as well, has a built in tuner. covers in the high 80's for ntsc color gamut, not bad for a "cheap" 26" monitor.

Vizios are in fact a good budget brand. I don't usually recommend them, as you can try waiting for a samsung to go on sale... but if you don't fee like it you wouldn't be disappointed with a vizio.

CRT's are typically better than LCD's though for monitors. It sounds like there's something more going on however, because my LCD monitor doesn't do that at all and it's only got a 5ms response time in comparison. I don't know enough to be of any kind of real help though. Good luck.

Iggy · 03-13-2009, 10:47 PM

I'm thinking you guys are nuts.

No offense.

I've been using computers longer than a nice handfull of you have been alive. My 22" Samsung 226BW is hands down, the best monitor I've ever owned. 2ms response time, as I've heard anything above 5ms will give you problems. I did some research before I bought it, and got a fair amount of replies.

I would never switch my LCD for a CRT. The picture is so clear, I can count the hairs and pores on someones face from 3 feet back. I have a CRT on my backup computer, and of course, the one built into my C= SX-64. However, unless it's necessary, I prefer to not use them.

Also, if anybody needs a CRT monitor, let me know.... I have a dozen or more of them laying around here, that I'll let go dirt cheap. Yes, they work.

Zatoichi · 03-14-2009, 01:12 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by BinaryLife

Vizios are in fact a good budget brand. I don't usually recommend them, as you can try waiting for a samsung to go on sale... but if you don't fee like it you wouldn't be disappointed with a vizio.

CRT's are typically better than LCD's though for monitors. It sounds like there's something more going on however, because my LCD monitor doesn't do that at all and it's only got a 5ms response time in comparison. I don't know enough to be of any kind of real help though. Good luck.

Yeah I actually compared pictures before buying, and found that the vizio i chose had comparable picture quality to many of the samsungs and sonys that had a higher price tag. the only caveat that ive found with the vizio is that sometimes when i turn it on, i have to turn it back off then on again to get the sound to work, this happens very rarely.

Ihmhi · 03-14-2009, 08:05 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iggy

Also, if anybody needs a CRT monitor, let me know.... I have a dozen or more of them laying around here, that I'll let go dirt cheap. Yes, they work.

Iggy, the nonprofit I do work with, Safe Haven, could use a few monitors for their computer lab. Would you consider donating some of them?

PartialSchism · 03-15-2009, 04:58 AM

DONT DO IT IGGY!

The priests will use them to stream thier alterboy pr0n.

03-08-2009, 07:53 AM	#6
KubeDawg Nade Whore Server Owner Beta Tester Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Oklahoma Class/Position: Scout/Soldier Gametype: CTF/TDM Affiliations: blunt. Moto Posts Rated Helpful 128 Times	The only time I noticed a difference between my CRT and my LCD widescreen was for a few days after I installed it. It has a 5ms response time, and I really don't notice any difference, in fact, it's often clearer than a CRT. __________________ Moto's Funhouse \| Dallas, TX - 74.91.114.247:27015 ff_plunder - Complete

03-11-2009, 05:59 PM	#11
Mooga Colorless FTW D&A Member Beta Tester Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: A Small Box Affiliations: SRCDS.com Posts Rated Helpful 1 Times	I actually find the colors on LCDs BETTER my old CRT. And I'm not using anything special, just used Hand-Me-Down LCDs... __________________ ~ Mooga ...w00t? SRCDS.com \| Twitter

03-12-2009, 05:33 AM	#14
Skanky Butterpuss Beware the Hammer D&A Member Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Mar 2007 Class/Position: Sabotaging your shit. Affiliations: :}\|, mimic, /KBN/ Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	not many people who know shit about tvs nowadays will laugh at a vizio. they are definitely the best budget brand out there, and their performance is damn good for the price. i got a samsung ln32a450, which has a 5ms response time, and i havent noticed ghosting on it at all. but, crts are always superior to lcds when it comes to that aspect, there is no doubt about that. for me, though, the convenience of a flat panel lcd far outweighs the nigh unnoticeable improvement in picture. __________________ Support FF: Etzell: Skanky Etzell: The Wings are fucking fantastic Etzell: They really are Etzell: But even SAYING that makes me want to vomit

03-08-2009, 01:11 AM	#2
Innoc Hitman 2 1 Actual Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: "Oscar Mike" Gametype: FPS or RTS (just say NO to MMO) Affiliations: Your Mom Posts Rated Helpful 8 Times	I can't play on LCD's. I keep waiting for generation that provides CRT equivalent color (I believe that the max in color reproduction for LCD is like 70%) and performance without being super expensive. I've tried various Samsung's, Viewsonics, ACER, ASUS, LG and Dell's over the years...no dice. Even those that were claimed to be high performance and quick response...weren't. We've been hearing about OLED and LED backlit LCD and other technologies coming for years...but still nothing. I suspect that the economic downturn will only hurt the advancement for this.

03-08-2009, 03:00 AM	#3
PartialSchism Keep On Keepin' On Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Mississippi Class/Position: Offense Gametype: Fun Affiliations: I'm bad at FF, and my customs suck Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	This is the type of thing that keeps me away from LCD or any other monitor. Im still using a factory Dell CRT that works great. I don't wanna lose any performance / visuals because some flat monitor takes up less space on my desktop, and gives me a bigger picture.

03-08-2009, 05:51 AM	#4
Shadow00Caster Retired FF Staff Join Date: Jul 2007 Class/Position: D Eng Gametype: Griefing/Spawn Camping Posts Rated Helpful 5 Times	I had budunkadunk-butt monitors for years before I finally switched to lcd's. My problem is that one, no lcd could support the resolutions I use on my crts, 2, I could see the slightest ghosting and everything else, 3, the viewing angles. It took me 7 years to find lcd's that I found to be up to par with my specific needs .. and my crt's were dying and making funny noises =x. I ended up spending 1500 on 2 24" asus lcd's .. it has always been that no lcd would replace my crt's and the ones that did cost waaaaay to much.

03-08-2009, 06:01 AM	#5
Innoc Hitman 2 1 Actual Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: "Oscar Mike" Gametype: FPS or RTS (just say NO to MMO) Affiliations: Your Mom Posts Rated Helpful 8 Times	I just had a terrible thought....I wonder if we'll fondly remember CRT's some day within the "they just don't make them like that anymore" vein...we're eventually forced to LCD only and the technology to make them work well for everyone never becomes reasonably priced....ugh...

03-08-2009, 06:27 PM	#7
Agent Buckshot Moose Wiki Standards Team Wiki Team Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Geokill's closet Class/Position: Sniper/Demoman Gametype: CTF Affiliations: :e0: Co-leader Posts Rated Helpful 6 Times	My LCD has a 2ms response time. You need to find something 5 or lower if you want to use it for gaming without suffering ghosting problems.

03-11-2009, 01:28 PM	#9
MonoXideAtWork Pub Allstar! Beta Tester Join Date: Aug 2008 Class/Position: under en kvinna Gametype: Capture the Flag Affiliations: Eternal Order, Must be h4x, Mono's happy funtime. Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	anyone used a 120hz lcd for gaming?

03-11-2009, 04:09 PM	#10
Icculus D&A Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: New Hampshire Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	I have a Dell 19" LCD that I use for gaming. I'm used to it now but the CRT definitely gave a better picture.

03-12-2009, 03:18 AM	#13
Zatoichi Join Date: Jul 2007 Location: Upstate New York Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	i went from a crt to a dell 2001fp 1600x1200 20.5" with 8ms response time and had no ghosting. whenever i chose either a tv or monitor i look at a variety, with different content on them. a lot of people laughed when heard i bought a vizio 47" 1080p lcd tv, but they stop after they see it..its not one of the cutting edge 120hz tv's but its smooth in fast action, bright, with a great viewing angle, just a great picture. same thing goes for the samsung t260hd monitor i just bought a month ago, i compared image quality and size along with how they handled different content. the response time is great, no ghosting. and even though its a 6 bit tn panel, whatever dithering they use works great. this doubles as an hdtv as well, has a built in tuner. covers in the high 80's for ntsc color gamut, not bad for a "cheap" 26" monitor.

03-13-2009, 08:20 AM	#15
noeffeks Waiting for Warpath Join Date: Nov 2007 Location: US Virgin Islands Gametype: CTF Posts Rated Helpful 2 Times	that and lcd's dont hurt my eyes.

03-15-2009, 04:58 AM	#20
PartialSchism Keep On Keepin' On Join Date: Feb 2008 Location: Mississippi Class/Position: Offense Gametype: Fun Affiliations: I'm bad at FF, and my customs suck Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	DONT DO IT IGGY! The priests will use them to stream thier alterboy pr0n.

Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)