Fortress Forever

Go Back   Fortress Forever > Community > General Discussion

Reply
 
Thread Tools Display Modes
Old 02-16-2008, 06:17 PM   #61
mixer
Interzone technican
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times
Quote:
Originally Posted by squeek.
What? The resup-packs on aardvark? Could you show me those?
sure

Quote:
I think you're confused...
i dont think so ...

Quote:
EDIT: And, all the defense got a boost as well. I think you're playing the wrong game.
those enhanced defence-class are gonna be used in offence as well, thanks to the jumppad and raised bh-cap ... i just dont see the logic why engi and sniper got nerved so much ... too much for me ...
mixer is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 06:23 PM   #62
squeek.
Stuff Do-er
Lua Team
Wiki Team
Fortress Forever Staff
 
squeek.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Northern California
Class/Position: Rallygun Shooter
Gametype: Conc tag (you just wait)
Affiliations: Mustache Brigade
Posts Rated Helpful 352 Times
Send a message via AIM to squeek.
Quote:
Originally Posted by mixer
those enhanced defence-class are gonna be used in offence as well, thanks to the jumppad and raised bh-cap ... i just dont see the logic why engi and sniper got nerved so much ... too much for me ...
We will see if heavy offense is a good idea or a bad idea once the leagues start. A light offense may outcap a heavy offense. Only time will tell. Plus, defense has the luxury of resupplies. And organization. And double/triple-teaming. Heavy offense should get destroyed by a competent defense.

People say the engi got nerfed, people say the engi got buffed. I'd say that's confirmation that the engi is at a sweet spot. The sniper I can't really comment on.
__________________
#FF.Pickup ¤ Fortress-Forever pickups

My Non-official Maps
Released FF_DM_Squeek - FF_2Mesa3_Classic - FF_Siege_Classic
Beta FF_Myth - FF_Redlight_Greenlight

Sick of the people on the internet, always moanin'. They just moan.
- Karl Pilkington
squeek. is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 06:23 PM   #63
BinaryLife
Posts: 1 bajillion
D&A Member
Wiki Team
 
BinaryLife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Gametype: CTF
Posts Rated Helpful 5 Times
Send a message via AIM to BinaryLife
Quote:
Originally Posted by mixer

those enhanced defence-class are gonna be used in offence as well, thanks to the jumppad and raised bh-cap ... i just dont see the logic why engi and sniper got nerved so much ... too much for me ...

The engy's ground push makes the sg a lot harder to take down even with the other adjustments made. That alone is a fair balance to the changes. The sniper NEEDED a change, too many times a sniper running across the map would easily AR me to death.
BinaryLife is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 06:37 PM   #64
Paft
Beta Tester
 
Paft's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: UK - http://forums.fortress-forever.com
Class/Position: [O] Med
Gametype: CTF/Skills
Posts Rated Helpful 67 Times
Just had a runaround offline, it's looking and feeling fantastic. I like all the new little touches and the the extra options in the menu for ones that aren't familiar with the console/commands.
Paft is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 06:43 PM   #65
bokko
when ff will out?
D&A Member
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times
Quote:
Originally Posted by mixer
well after playing few rounds again im rather disappointed with the offence-emphasis of this patch ... they gone so far they even reduced the cells in the resup-backs on aardvark. Technically everythings fine, but the balance is way off imho ... im gonna wait for the next patch ... cu then.
mop it up
bokko is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 07:37 PM   #66
eva01
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tsukasa
I think the trails should only be visible when movement is present, the fruity RED RAINBOW, BLUEBERRY, AND MANGO TOO! grenades are... well fruity.
I agree with this, the trails are cool leave them in, but lose the glow when they're sitting on the ground.

Demo is much better now, though his blue pipes explode TOO quick now. Just tweak it a little bit, maybe .3 or .4 seconds longer. He's a beast now. Much better controls on pipe placement too. However it's almost too easy to time pipe det with the trails now.

Solider is super powerful now, a bit too powerful. I love playing soldier but I think you could tone him down a bit. Rocket jumps are even easier now and he definitely feels faster. However there seems to be a weird lag right after you rj. The nail gren can stay though=)

SG models look great, though they are definitely much weaker. MIRV spam in Aardvark to the security bridge is a guaranteed kill now.

Medic medkit is great, makes him much more useful. He seems faster and more powerful too. For some reason it feels like his nailgun is faster, but I don't think I saw that in the changelog. I was able to use his nailgun to kill pretty easily when I tried it.

Pyro is still superpowered, I know his IC is toned down but he still kills everyone pretty easily with the 3 hit combo. The new arc on the IC takes some getting use to now.

Mancannon is cool, but I'd rather see it go away. It just changes too much of the gameplay.

Overall this patch makes this game more newb friendly, which is good since it'll attract more players. It feels faster which is always nice, but I'd still like it to be faster/smoother (a la ETF).
eva01 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 07:55 PM   #67
groovyf
In the clouds
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Halifax, UK
Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times
Quote:
Originally Posted by Handym
Also, the fov changes while travelling while flying are really annoying. I'dd much rather have the motion blur..
You can turn off the FOV effect in the Fortress Options
groovyf is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 07:58 PM   #68
Paft
Beta Tester
 
Paft's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: UK - http://forums.fortress-forever.com
Class/Position: [O] Med
Gametype: CTF/Skills
Posts Rated Helpful 67 Times
Quote:
Originally Posted by groovyf
You can turn off the FOV effect in the Fortress Options
And the grenade targets. You guys are hopeless .
Paft is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 08:03 PM   #69
squeek.
Stuff Do-er
Lua Team
Wiki Team
Fortress Forever Staff
 
squeek.'s Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Northern California
Class/Position: Rallygun Shooter
Gametype: Conc tag (you just wait)
Affiliations: Mustache Brigade
Posts Rated Helpful 352 Times
Send a message via AIM to squeek.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paft
And the grenade targets. You guys are hopeless .
Let's try this.

CHECK OUT THE FORTRESS OPTIONS MENU
__________________
#FF.Pickup ¤ Fortress-Forever pickups

My Non-official Maps
Released FF_DM_Squeek - FF_2Mesa3_Classic - FF_Siege_Classic
Beta FF_Myth - FF_Redlight_Greenlight

Sick of the people on the internet, always moanin'. They just moan.
- Karl Pilkington
squeek. is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 08:04 PM   #70
trepid_jon
Ray Ray Johnson
Fortress Forever Staff
 
trepid_jon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Location: Dallas, TX
Class/Position: D Civilian
Gametype: Rocket Jousting
Affiliations: EAFD
Posts Rated Helpful 78 Times
Send a message via ICQ to trepid_jon Send a message via AIM to trepid_jon
Hah, squeek had the same thing on his mind.

Yes, check out the Fortress Options menu, people.
__________________
Support FF:
Trepid
steamcommunity.com/id/trepid_jon/

Last edited by trepid_jon; 02-16-2008 at 08:13 PM.
trepid_jon is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 08:20 PM   #71
Ihmhi
[AE] 0112 Ihmhi *SJB
Wiki Team
Fortress Forever Staff
 
Ihmhi's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Newark, NJ, United States
Class/Position: A little bit o' everythin'
Gametype: Also a little bit o' everythin'
Affiliations: [AE] Asseater, *SJB Straight Jacket Brigade
Posts Rated Helpful 3 Times
Send a message via AIM to Ihmhi Send a message via MSN to Ihmhi Send a message via Yahoo to Ihmhi
I and many other testers pushed heavily to get the Pyro's flamethrower push up more for a few reasons. My reasons were, personally:

1) Makes him more viable on O
2) Can survive higher falls

As for 2, well... unlike the Spy, he doesn't exactly have the element of Stealth the spy does when he falls. You know, Spy can fall all ninja, Pyro has a huge jet of flames seemingly coming out of his ass, haha.

It can help you survive a lot of falls, though, and can be used to great effect with things like the IC+nade jump or the mancannon.
__________________
Support FF:
Anime: The Thread: Reloaded
The one and only anime thread on these here forums.

Select the pistol, and then, select your horse.
Ihmhi is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 08:43 PM   #72
TACO-BELL
 
TACO-BELL's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2007
Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times
Quote:
Originally Posted by mixer
i just dont see the logic why engi and sniper got nerved so much ... too much for me ...
Well, as someone who usually plays sniper, I'm not surprised the sniper took a big hit in this update. Most of the beta people are clanie's (who don't recruit snipers) and I've seen more than one start swearing and getting abusive on pubs when they get sniped. So with this group, it was really inevitable that sniper was going to get nerfed sooner or later. I just wish it had been in a more ingenious way that would still make sniper relevant in some context in the game rather than doing an easy "-20 to power".

FF sniping is a well done part of the game and hopefully it becomes useful sometime in the future. I would love it if sniper was reformed into a class that was acceptable/useful to clan people and could play a role in clan matches!!

That said, I've had alot of fun playing the other classes in 2.0. The gfx, class updates, and jump pads are alot of fun and its great not to have the client entity errors anymore. Even though my fav class was nerfed, still have to say "good job dev team"!!
TACO-BELL is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 09:02 PM   #73
MightyLotu
 
MightyLotu's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Location: Belgium
Posts Rated Helpful 1 Times
sniper needs a new autorifle imo.. or some completely different weapon.. it just doesn't fit in
and is it just me or does the muzzle flash appear under the ar instead of where it should be
there's hardly any "kickback" from the ar either
MightyLotu is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 09:18 PM   #74
mixer
Interzone technican
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times
Quote:
Originally Posted by TACO-BELL
Well, as someone who usually plays sniper, I'm not surprised the sniper took a big hit in this update. Most of the beta people are clanie's (who don't recruit snipers) and I've seen more than one start swearing and getting abusive on pubs when they get sniped. So with this group, it was really inevitable that sniper was going to get nerfed sooner or later.
i feard that as well, that the beta-players let their personal preferences sneak into the class-balance ... mabe even unconsciously, i think its inevitable somehow. It was the reason that the soldier was the holy-cow in older tf-versions, and it now seems to be here as well, too bad .... About the sniper-whining: anyone remember qwtf? a medicore sniper got 80-100 kills in 30mins, and a really skilled one on a good day did 180. The 1.11-sniper was lightyears away from that, and still he got nerved....
mixer is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 09:32 PM   #75
Meathook
 
Meathook's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Location: the enemies base
Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times
Send a message via AIM to Meathook Send a message via MSN to Meathook
Overall I'm disappointed.

I dont like all the jumping around non-sense. And getting conced through a 5 foot concrete wall. Pyros flying just as high and far as medics and scouts (on palmero). Sollys, and with the jump pads heavies too. I didnt test, but can heavies shoot while jumping still, even with using the pads? And can Snipers, while the juggled by a (flying) solly? The door button on Well was removed to further the "speed" agenda. All that is the opposite direction I would have liked the mod to take.

Snipers got taken down a notch AND the jump pads (AND the extra bit on crossover) were added making it easier for more classes to get up to the snipe decks. Again, not the direction I would have hoped for.

I think the skins (and glows(yes I know I can turn them off)) look silly.

I hadent played FF since a few days before xmas, then on xmas I got TF2. So I've been playing that, waiting for FF2.0... and waiting... Then it did come out, and last night I installed and played and it was ok. But really I was just trying to remember how my scripts worked, and how to play. But today while playing I couldnt stand it. My average life span (non Spy) was 5 seconds, because of the onslaught of the flying. I'd come out of spawn, and die. Really, FF has become a lot of what I really was hoping not to see it become. And it's now not at all my cup of tea. So I'm going back to TF2. This game seems really not fun anymore. Good luck with your mod.
Meathook is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 09:42 PM   #76
BinaryLife
Posts: 1 bajillion
D&A Member
Wiki Team
 
BinaryLife's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Gametype: CTF
Posts Rated Helpful 5 Times
Send a message via AIM to BinaryLife
Quote:
Originally Posted by mixer
i feard that as well, that the beta-players let their personal preferences sneak into the class-balance ... mabe even unconsciously, i think its inevitable somehow. It was the reason that the soldier was the holy-cow in older tf-versions, and it now seems to be here as well, too bad .... About the sniper-whining: anyone remember qwtf? a medicore sniper got 80-100 kills in 30mins, and a really skilled one on a good day did 180. The 1.11-sniper was lightyears away from that, and still he got nerved....
The process itself works a little differentlty than it may seem. The bias players experience in their class choices actualy help balance the mod as each player's wants overlap. That way a sniper will fight against getting nerfed while an engy will maintain that his SG needs more power. This way it's cut down to a point where the lovers of the classes can find a happy medium.

I think the sniper needs to be reworked, but I don't think it's an issue of power. I think the problem is he was too powerful. This is coming from me playing as a sniper. it's the first class I picked up when FF came out. It was so easy to return to skill wise and during the first few weeks I found that the class was too easy to play as and I stopped. Now I generaly avoid the class only because of its ease. I agree it needs some changes, but the balance, I think is around.

And where were all you jump pad haters when they proposed it and every jumped on me for saying I wasn't sure. No one backed me up lol. I've only played it for short bursts, but I'll throw out something with more insight and info when I've pushed more of the mod to its possibly unbalanced side.
BinaryLife is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 09:45 PM   #77
chilledsanity
D&A Member
 
chilledsanity's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2007
Gametype: AvD, I/D, waterpolo, hunted
Posts Rated Helpful 6 Times
Quote:
EDIT: And, all the defense got a boost as well. I think you're playing the wrong game.
Giving offense a huge boost and defense a minor boost can still result in a slanted game. Play cornfield defense if you think things are nice and balanced.

Quote:
People say the engi got nerfed, people say the engi got buffed. I'd say that's confirmation that the engi is at a sweet spot.
That logic doesn't mean much since he literally WAS buffed and nerfed. I think the better sg tracking makes up for the sg health loss. Ground push was buffed, but air push was nerfed. This doesn't mean it's a sweet spot, it means that ground units have a rough time and air units can fly past an sg and cap. And god knows this patch makes things much friendlier for air units. I'm not saying that's a bad thing, but without giving defense better techniques to deal with them, it unbalances.
chilledsanity is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 09:46 PM   #78
mixer
Interzone technican
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times
Quote:
Originally Posted by BinaryLife
This is coming from me playing as a sniper. it's the first class I picked up when FF came out. It was so easy to return to skill wise and during the first few weeks I found that the class was too easy to play as and I stopped. Now I generaly avoid the class only because of its ease. .
i dont buy that, sorry ... too easy? imho the aiming is very unpredictable, and much more inconsistant than it was in other tf-incarnations i played ... but maybe you one of those sub-30 lpb's that may explain your view.
mixer is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 09:53 PM   #79
AfterShock
Fortress Forever Staff
 
AfterShock's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2007
Posts Rated Helpful 45 Times
Quote:
Pyros flying just as high and far as medics and scouts (on palmero).
Pyro's can't fly nearly as high as medics and scouts, and they can't control in the air or see where they are going nearly as well. It also takes them a lot longer to get to their destination.
Quote:
Sollys, and with the jump pads heavies too. I didnt test, but can heavies shoot while jumping still, even with using the pads?
Yes, but with the current HW system you'd be lucky to hit anything whilst flying through the air, so it's pretty pointless. And the bhop / slow-firing system slows the HW straight after he lands anyway..
Quote:
The door button on Well was removed to further the "speed" agenda.
Actually you have to get up closer to the front door to get in now, before you could shoot the door mid-conc and fly straight in. This way actually slows offense.
Quote:
I think the skins (and glows(yes I know I can turn them off)) look silly.
Personal preference but 99% of people prefer actually seeing the models than a black shadow shooting them.

Quote:
It was the reason that the soldier was the holy-cow in older tf-versions
Having the soldier as a solid defensive class is the backbone of a balanced game. In 1.11 I could do a mediocre conc and get past even the best soldier. Playing defense in 1.11 was pretty frustrating. HW overheats, demo's pipes hardly hit anything their radius is so small, players could walk past SGs without getting moved around, and soldiers need to be dead-on with their rockets to even hit the offense, which a lot of the time get a boost from it anyway (and then skim to safety). Added to this the fact that offense can trimp mid-rampslide and it makes playing soldier pretty crap pre 2.0.

The soldier certainly isn't the GOD of 2.0 in fact i'd say perhaps the pyro or demoman are the most powerful now... but it's very hard to say. The game is very well balanced now, with a decent ammo supply an HW can destroy everything. Soldiers are still very powerful but once they've used their 4 rockets they can be overwhelmed pretty quickly. Dont forget the nail grenade isn't nearly as destructive as the mirv or even arguably the EMP.

RE: AvD, yeah i know things are unbalanced in the offense's favour right now. This is mainly because the maps are designed to let 1 lucky offy run finish the map, rather than having the whole team push forward. We're working on a new gamemode type to fix this problem, but no promises as to when it'll surface

Last edited by AfterShock; 02-16-2008 at 09:58 PM.
AfterShock is offline   Reply With Quote


Old 02-16-2008, 10:06 PM   #80
mixer
Interzone technican
 
Join Date: Sep 2007
Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times
Quote:
Originally Posted by AfterShock
Having the soldier as a solid defensive class is the backbone of a balanced game. In 1.11 I could do a mediocre conc and get past even the best soldier.
and so, instead of leveling all classes you pick out one and make it uber ...
Quote:
Playing defense in 1.11 was pretty frustrating.
and it still is ... Demo is relaodding and reloading and reloading all the time, and the pipedelay that affects _all_ pipes instead of only the one just fired makes im weak in what he is supposed to do ...
Quote:
demo's pipes hardly hit anything their radius is so small
and the concer too fast ... the average player may have 60ms ping ... how the heck is he supposed to maintain a pipetrap? the lightspeed-concers combined with that annoying delay make it impossible.
Quote:
players could walk past SGs without getting moved around
and they still do
Quote:
and soldiers need to be dead-on with their rockets to even hit the offense
why should they have it easier than the other classes?
Quote:
The soldier certainly isn't the GOD of 2.0
hes pretty close, usable in every position, most fireing power, most accurate weapon, armor, ... simpley überpowert.
Quote:
in fact i'd say perhaps the pyro or demoman are the most powerful now
lets wait for a few clan-matches ... i bet at least 2 or 3 solies will be standard in every def-setup. And then they will be used in off as well ...
He was already the integral part of a def-setup in 1.11, which shows he was already powerfull enuff, yet he got enhanced so much .... no logic.
Quote:
... but it's very hard to say. The game is very well balanced now.
your opinion ...
mixer is offline   Reply With Quote


Reply


Currently Active Users Viewing This Thread: 1 (0 members and 1 guests)
 
Thread Tools
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


All times are GMT. The time now is 10:17 AM.


Powered by vBulletin® Version 3.8.7
Copyright ©2000 - 2024, vBulletin Solutions, Inc.