give demo-man greater range

[Noggin on Wheels]

I realy hate the demo-mans range as it has been reduced severly, before a dem-man could hit long range targets and prove a deadly force. now though his range is crippled and he is taken out by nailguns and other mid range weapons. this thread is a campaign to give the demo-mans range back. i do of course realise that the demo man was crippled in order to balance the classes out but i dont agree that it should be done by hampering his range.

[im2cool4uroflolz]

Wow, you always have bad ideas.

He uses explosives. If you want explosives with range, play Soldier. Simple as that.

[Credge]

What range? Do you mean blues?

[MonoXideAtWork]

can we get some specifics on where you think it SHOULD be, so we can have a starting place? Thanks.

[Demasu]

Originally Posted by im2cool4uroflolz

Wow, you always have bad ideas.

Hey, think of something better to say, or don't fucking say it.

Edit: Clarity: I'm talking about the quoted sentence, not the original idea.

[Gator-]

I don't see anything wrong with the demoman, and this is Gator speaking directly at you.

If you're talking about "range," well, it was actually improved. The blue pipes now blow up slower allowing you to take some enemies from far range. If you're talking about the "range" of the yellow pipes, try to setup a better pipetrap and practice your reaction.

[elwood]

Originally Posted by Gator-

I don't see anything wrong with the demoman, and this is Alligator speaking directly at you.

fixed.

alligator gives some decent bit of advice here even if he speaks directly at you. just don't look directly at him noggin, you may turn to stone. other than that i'd go with what's been already mentioned.

if anything the demoman's blue pipe radius/hit box needs to be lowered because it's too damn easy to hit a blue pipe currently.

[PartialSchism]

Thread should have been placed in bug / feature tracker IMO.

I also approve Gator's message.

[Gator-]

Originally Posted by elwood

fixed.

alligator gives some decent bit of advice here even if he speaks directly at you. just don't look directly at him noggin, you may turn to stone. other than that i'd go with what's been already mentioned.

pathetic, you must be bored

[Lateralols]

I agree with Elwood, 'cause he's not Alligator.

[chilledsanity]

God there is so much miscommunication here. Here's what I think is happening:

prior to FF 2.0:
Blue pipes had a range of 2.5s, similar to TFC

FF 2.0:
Fuse was reduced to 1.1s, making them pretty short

FF 2.1+:
Fuse raised to 1.3s, making them not as short


So yes, they have piss-poor range compared to TFC or early versions of FF. They're better for dm'ing, but poorer for ranged area control.

Noggin on Wheels: You could describe the problem you have more clearly and I already wasted a thread or two several months back for 2.0 trying to get the fuse raised. No one cares except a minority of people. There was talk of variable fuses, but it was shot down because of not wanting to "divide the community".

Gator: It's only gone up if you count since 2.0. Also green pipes only work if you're not actively using them to guard the flag, which most D demomen should be doing anyway.

[onE]

Originally Posted by chilledsanity

God there is so much miscommunication here. Here's what I think is happening:

prior to FF 2.0:
Blue pipes had a range of 2.5s, similar to TFC

FF 2.0:
Fuse was reduced to 1.1s, making them pretty short

FF 2.1+:
Fuse raised to 1.3s, making them not as short


So yes, they have piss-poor range compared to TFC or early versions of FF. They're better for dm'ing, but poorer for ranged area control.

Noggin on Wheels: You could describe the problem you have more clearly and I already wasted a thread or two several months back for 2.0 trying to get the fuse raised. No one cares except a minority of people. There was talk of variable fuses, but it was shot down because of not wanting to "divide the community".

Gator: It's only gone up if you count since 2.0. Also green pipes only work if you're not actively using them to guard the flag, which most D demomen should be doing anyway.

OMG THEY ARE YELLOW!!!!

It does seem like they dont travel as far as they did in TFC. And being takin out by a nailgun as demo??!?! Time to try a different class.

[Noggin on Wheels]

you have brought legitimacy to this un-couth thread >.>, yes iam refering to the sick range in FF 2.0 and that although it has been increased in recent updates it does not compare to the range the demo-man had in 2.0 and TFC. i would really like it if the devs would conscider giving the demo-man his range back. i find often when attacking with demo-man and running across the open areas i am getting slaughtered by enemys who shoot at me from outside the reach of my pipes, and with little else to choose from the demo-mans arsenal i am left weak and defenceles >.>

[Credge]

Originally Posted by Noggin on Wheels

you have brought legitimacy to this un-couth thread >.>, yes iam refering to the sick range in FF 2.0 and that although it has been increased in recent updates it does not compare to the range the demo-man had in 2.0 and TFC. i would really like it if the devs would conscider giving the demo-man his range back. i find often when attacking with demo-man and running across the open areas i am getting slaughtered by enemys who shoot at me from outside the reach of my pipes, and with little else to choose from the demo-mans arsenal i am left weak and defenceles >.>

The problem, then, isn't with the range but with the timer on them. However, the only time you'd really feel a difference is on maps like Congestus. In TFC, and in past versions of FF, you could land blues on the bottom floor from the flag and have them bounce a little. Now they explode right before they hit.

The range hasn't changed though, that is, that if the timer was increased there wouldn't be any difference. This is what others are saying.

Anyway, the demoman is an area denial class. His YELLOW pipes are his main tool at stopping enemies from passing by a spot and his blue pipes are used to dispatch enemies that are coming down halls, going up ladders, or other areas where the enemy will have a hard time avoiding the explosives.

I too feel that the timer change was not needed, but for a different reason. The shorter timer seems to promote spam. Before, if you spammed blues, you had to know where the enemy was coming from a full two seconds before. Now, due to how short the timer is, that knowledge really isn't needed.

[Crazycarl]

Long-fuse blues are pretty useless for anything but spamming doorways. In 2.5 seconds the enemy has plenty of time to get out of the way. You can use grellows instead, which explode whenever you desire.

[SiSCoS]

or resort to the QTF Demoman version with a long range blue pipe launcher. Difference was instead of like a 10ft shot (just using a example of FF Grenade Launcher dont know the range) put another weapon in the demoman's inventory such as the long range grenade launcher which shoots like 30ft (still detting at 1.3 seconds so that means its gonna have to be able to shoot the grenade from launcher to target fast)


quake team fortress demoman had an axe, single shotty, grenade launcher, long range grenade launcher, pipe launcher

[SmellyCat]

I'm all for changing blue det times back to over 2 seconds. Makes things a hell of a lot easier on offence. :P

[Circuitous]

Note to admins: lock suggestion and bug threads and direct them to the bug tracker so that I don't have to leave notes like this and do it myself.

To OP: use the bug/suggestion tracker. It's on top.