So why the disdain for Teleporters?

EngeeMan · 05-02-2008, 09:33 PM

I used to play TFC religiously, every day after school and on the weekends. I loved it and basically was my favorite game ever. Eventually though I grew tired of it and quit.

A few(?) years passed and just reading random posting about TFC brought up the mention of teleporters. Apparently I had stopped playing before these were added to the game. Also apparently they were disliked by a majority of the people who mentioned them.

Why is this? In a game where you could leap across the entire map in an instant or jump across huge stretches with just a few hops and wobbling of the mouse I don't see how a teleporter would affect movement at all.

I never experienced them in gameplay in TFC, but they seem to work fine in TF2. There's a cool down time, particles swirling around people who teleported so you know there's a tele around, and they are easy to destroy if they aren't hidden away well enough.

So why were they so bad in TFC?

Dr.Satan · 05-02-2008, 10:58 PM

yes...yes they were. They completely destroyed the mechanics of the game b/c you could literally spawn a hw in the enemy base 5sec after he was killed. Things were so much better back before they came...that's why the FF devs removed them.

Firefox11 · 05-02-2008, 11:02 PM

I guess people were used to the delay enemies had to return into position, even taking consideration of the instant spawn, so having a Soldier down in the FR of 2fort after killing him in the Ramp Room was kind of annoying, I guess. Don't know if this is the reason, because I mainly played AvD TFC. There the teles didn't affect that much, only the spam delay after killing the Demoman was cut from 10+ seconds to 4 or 5. But that's part of the game, IMO, so have the Spies deal with the Sentries and the Teleporters, in that order.

EngeeMan · 05-02-2008, 11:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr.Satan

yes...yes they were. They completely destroyed the mechanics of the game b/c you could literally spawn a hw in the enemy base 5sec after he was killed. Things were so much better back before they came...that's why the FF devs removed them.

So were the teleporters difficult to find, difficult to destroy, didn't have any cool down times between teleports, unlimited positioning of teleports, or was it the instant respawn?

What makes things so different in TF2 with teleporters and the way they are implemented and the way they worked in TFC as you say "completely destroy[ing] the mechanics of the game"?

If they worked like you say things would be even worse in TF2 because after the heavy killed you that spawned in your base it would take 3-15 seconds for you to respawn and in that time a new enemy might be able to come over. However, in practice it just doesn't seem that way unless they build SGs and dispensers all around and basically make a little base right out of your basement. But if they were allowed to do that your team likely wasn't going to win anyway,

Peon · 05-02-2008, 11:30 PM

My 2 cents on this, is that the TFC teleporters enabled the enemy team to set up an encampment inside your Fortress, from which they could add regular reinforcments. It was very hard to remove an enemy nest from the attic in Well, if they had a teleporter set up. It mostly screwed up the flow of CTF maps.

Pixel · 05-02-2008, 11:46 PM

Maybe.... A teleporter with a range? So you know you can't go ridiciously far. Maybe add a cooldown after each teleportation?

Yeah?

slay2rr · 05-02-2008, 11:54 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by EngeeMan

What makes things so different in TF2 with teleporters and the way they are implemented and the way they worked in TFC as you say "completely destroy[ing] the mechanics of the game"?

It is because TF2's pace, once again if you kill a soldier in the 2fort ramp room you won't encounter him inside the flagroom because of the respawn timer. In TFC the respawn is instant.

bokko · 05-03-2008, 12:43 AM

If you are really interested, there's about a hundred threads on this matter back when discussions about game mechanics were actually original. There was even one thread stickied for a while if I remember correctly, with an abundance of replies.

Circuitous · 05-03-2008, 04:02 AM

TF2's teleporters are optimized for TF2's existing maps. You can't, for example, build them in spawn areas. Teleporters are accessible by enemies at all times and can have both parts destroyed. This wasn't the case in TFC - you could sit teleporters in resupplies and make them completely inaccessible to enemies, providing either an instant reset for defenders or getting offense in the enemy base faster, with no way of stopping them.

Maps could be optimized in FF to allow for teleporters, but the effort required is more than the potential gain. It's not a necessary feature.

Anyway, this thread is plenty over with.

05-02-2008, 09:33 PM	#1
EngeeMan Banned Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	So why the disdain for Teleporters? I used to play TFC religiously, every day after school and on the weekends. I loved it and basically was my favorite game ever. Eventually though I grew tired of it and quit. A few(?) years passed and just reading random posting about TFC brought up the mention of teleporters. Apparently I had stopped playing before these were added to the game. Also apparently they were disliked by a majority of the people who mentioned them. Why is this? In a game where you could leap across the entire map in an instant or jump across huge stretches with just a few hops and wobbling of the mouse I don't see how a teleporter would affect movement at all. I never experienced them in gameplay in TFC, but they seem to work fine in TF2. There's a cool down time, particles swirling around people who teleported so you know there's a tele around, and they are easy to destroy if they aren't hidden away well enough. So why were they so bad in TFC?

05-02-2008, 10:58 PM	#2
Dr.Satan Wiki Team Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Greeley, CO Class/Position: Med / Solly Gametype: PAYLOAD Affiliations: DET- Posts Rated Helpful 19 Times	yes...yes they were. They completely destroyed the mechanics of the game b/c you could literally spawn a hw in the enemy base 5sec after he was killed. Things were so much better back before they came...that's why the FF devs removed them. __________________ FF Community Map Pack(s): 1 / 2 (Released) conc_school \| hellion_classic \| ksour_PAYLOAD \| mulch_faf (Beta) alchimy_b1 (Lua) base_payload_2015 (Models) props_trainyard Support FF:

05-02-2008, 11:30 PM	#5
Peon Altitude Junkie D&A Member Join Date: Jul 2007 Class/Position: Agressive Medic or Pyro...as long as I can fly baby! Gametype: CTF Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	My 2 cents on this, is that the TFC teleporters enabled the enemy team to set up an encampment inside your Fortress, from which they could add regular reinforcments. It was very hard to remove an enemy nest from the attic in Well, if they had a teleporter set up. It mostly screwed up the flow of CTF maps. __________________ "The very existence of flamethrowers proves that sometime, somewhere, someone said to themselves, “You know, I want to set those people over there on fire, but I’m just not close enough to get the job done.”" - George Carlin

05-03-2008, 04:02 AM	#9
Circuitous Useless Retired FF Staff Join Date: Jun 2005 Class/Position: D Soldier, O Scout Gametype: AvD Posts Rated Helpful 9 Times	TF2's teleporters are optimized for TF2's existing maps. You can't, for example, build them in spawn areas. Teleporters are accessible by enemies at all times and can have both parts destroyed. This wasn't the case in TFC - you could sit teleporters in resupplies and make them completely inaccessible to enemies, providing either an instant reset for defenders or getting offense in the enemy base faster, with no way of stopping them. Maps could be optimized in FF to allow for teleporters, but the effort required is more than the potential gain. It's not a necessary feature. Anyway, this thread is plenty over with. __________________ Look at all those dead links.

05-02-2008, 11:02 PM	#3
Firefox11 Join Date: Dec 2007 Class/Position: O&D: Pyro, Sniper Gametype: AvD Affiliations: FF.AvD [FF AvD/ID guild] Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	I guess people were used to the delay enemies had to return into position, even taking consideration of the instant spawn, so having a Soldier down in the FR of 2fort after killing him in the Ramp Room was kind of annoying, I guess. Don't know if this is the reason, because I mainly played AvD TFC. There the teles didn't affect that much, only the spam delay after killing the Demoman was cut from 10+ seconds to 4 or 5. But that's part of the game, IMO, so have the Spies deal with the Sentries and the Teleporters, in that order.

05-02-2008, 11:46 PM	#6
Pixel if(0>1){printf("broked");} Beta Tester Join Date: Mar 2007 Location: Amerika Class/Position: O Posts Rated Helpful 3 Times	Maybe.... A teleporter with a range? So you know you can't go ridiciously far. Maybe add a cooldown after each teleportation? Yeah?

05-03-2008, 12:43 AM	#8
bokko when ff will out? D&A Member Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	If you are really interested, there's about a hundred threads on this matter back when discussions about game mechanics were actually original. There was even one thread stickied for a while if I remember correctly, with an abundance of replies.

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