(PC) CS:GO and FF's future.

Credge · 11-22-2014, 09:25 AM

I put this in gaming because it isn't directly about FF and having it on the general discussion area isn't the best idea for FF.

Here in the next few weeks/months we will be experiencing an apocalypse of epic gaming proportions that will ripple down the history of competitive gaming for a very long time. To summarize what's going on, the Steam Workshop allows players to download any hack without having to do anything.

Here's a breakdown of how this works from the hack creators side.

I create a hack and make it hidden in the Steam Workshop.
I get people to pay me money to have access to the file.
I update the file regularly to do my best to avoid VAC bans.

Here's what it looks like from the players side:

I buy access to the Steam Workshop hack.
I set it to autodownload and install whenever I log in to my Steam account.
I can use these hacks at any LAN without being detected as long as it isn't an obtrusive hack.

This has been going on for as long as the Steam Workshop has existed. Further, because of the nature of these hacks (auto update via steam), they are incredibly hard to detect. Even further, this is extremely similar to what some players were doing when they went to LAN parties or tournaments before the Steam Workshop and it's why some tournaments require you use the mice, keyboards, and headsets they provide.

So, how does this tie in to the future of FF?

Although FF will be moving to a new engine, this game should not have any sort of non-map user content creation. That is to say, if the U4 engine has the ability to have a Steam Workshop styled thing, don't do it. Don't allow Steam Workshop to be a thing with this mod. Don't allow the Steam Workshop to be a thing with Source 2. Do not allow leagues to host your game if they don't actively work against hackers (I'm looking at UCG). Actively seek out those who are not on the up-and-up.

The days of the auto-snap aimbot are long, long gone. The modern face of hacking is very clever and very subtle. No game has been exempt from it, and FF was not exception. We will see in the next few months the face of online competitive gaming, at least in FPS, change dramatically.

FDA_Approved · 11-22-2014, 10:04 AM

TL;DR version:

Cheaters be cheating, except this time it's the end of the world, and we can't have nice things anymore.

Except for not really, chill out.

AfterShock · 11-22-2014, 06:25 PM

Until valve just starts noticing and bans all the accounts, because they run steam workshop and probably have all the data they need.

Credge · 11-23-2014, 08:35 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FDA_Approved

TL;DR version:

Cheaters be cheating, except this time it's the end of the world, and we can't have nice things anymore.

Except for not really, chill out.

Not really. The sophistication of the cheats have been around ages, everyone has known about them, people have used them to win big money in tournaments, and nobody has done anything about it until now.

Here's some fun reading.

http://www.hltv.org/blog/8956-the-tr...ng-bread-cheat

Quote:

Originally Posted by AfterShock

Until valve just starts noticing and bans all the accounts, because they run steam workshop and probably have all the data they need.

Apparently it's a bit more complicated than one steam workshop file. From my understanding, pieces of this cheat can be found in various items, skins, and collections. The creator of this hack that has recently been outted has also distributed small tiny bits to skin and map makers as a bit of extra coding in textures and the like.

It's really ingenious. It's also a pay for a certain amount of time sort of thing. The entire process is very intricate and not brute-force like most other hacks.

homie in reboks' · 11-23-2014, 12:11 PM

This is only important in CS:GO because it's professional players that are likely cheating at LAN event with prize pools of $250K.

There's very little incentive to cheat at FF. No one will be wasting their time making cheats for FF that operate in this manner. Why? Because there are no FF LAN events and there are no prize pools of $10 let alone $250K.

Also, this is basically just a regurgitation of the /r/GlobalOffensive thread.

Credge · 11-23-2014, 07:24 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by homie in reboks'

This is only important in CS:GO because it's professional players that are likely cheating at LAN event with prize pools of $250K.

There's very little incentive to cheat at FF. No one will be wasting their time making cheats for FF that operate in this manner. Why? Because there are no FF LAN events and there are no prize pools of $10 let alone $250K.

Also, this is basically just a regurgitation of the /r/GlobalOffensive thread.

I do not agree. There's little incentive to cheat in any game when there's nothing on the line, yet, people do it. The fact that people are cheating at LAN events, perform like the following videos, and nobody cares until someone gets VAC banned is even more troubling.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TNcOqUa93B4#t=592

YouTube

YouTube

YouTube

YouTube

All of these are the same player. We saw this very behavior in this game with leagues, yet, UGC did nothing and anytime it was brought up the person bringing it out was considered a scrub.

I do not agree that it's only a CS:GO issue. CS:GO is simply a very large game that, unfortunately, shares the same anti-cheat that FF does.

Mainly, the point of the thread isn't to go "SEE, CHEATERS HAPPEN AND IT'S BAD", it's more to expose the how of it all.

Here's some more reading.

http://www.hltv.org/blog/8956-the-tr...ng-bread-cheat

http://www.hltv.org/blog/8959-the-tr...for-him-and-me

AfterShock · 11-23-2014, 12:33 PM

reading that thread, there were a few top players using a complex cheat, and they got found out and VAC banned, along with their 2 digit steamID accounts worth £10k

Doesn't sound like cheaters are winning to me.

Anyone who wants to code a cheat purely for FF would probably be better off joining the dev team and coding features for the game instead..

KubeDawg · 11-23-2014, 06:49 PM

I thought all the 1 and 2 digit accounts were basically all Valve employees/developers.

In any case, this likely will have 0 effect on FF, even if there is some major spark in play once released on Steam and Steam Workshop is open, I really doubt much will come of it. I understand there are much more subtle ways for someone to cheat these days, so as to avoid detection, but I'm of the opinion that if you are clever enough to not get caught with a cheat, then who really cares? In the grand scheme of things, it's just a video game.

Though I'd probably cheat too if I knew I had a decent chance at a $250k prize pool in CS:GO hah, but I'm probably at the opposite of the skill spectrum and cheats would not help me at all.

11-22-2014, 09:25 AM	#1
Credge FF Loremaster Beta Tester Join Date: Sep 2007 Posts Rated Helpful 4 Times	CS:GO and FF's future. I put this in gaming because it isn't directly about FF and having it on the general discussion area isn't the best idea for FF. Here in the next few weeks/months we will be experiencing an apocalypse of epic gaming proportions that will ripple down the history of competitive gaming for a very long time. To summarize what's going on, the Steam Workshop allows players to download any hack without having to do anything. Here's a breakdown of how this works from the hack creators side. I create a hack and make it hidden in the Steam Workshop. I get people to pay me money to have access to the file. I update the file regularly to do my best to avoid VAC bans. Here's what it looks like from the players side: I buy access to the Steam Workshop hack. I set it to autodownload and install whenever I log in to my Steam account. I can use these hacks at any LAN without being detected as long as it isn't an obtrusive hack. This has been going on for as long as the Steam Workshop has existed. Further, because of the nature of these hacks (auto update via steam), they are incredibly hard to detect. Even further, this is extremely similar to what some players were doing when they went to LAN parties or tournaments before the Steam Workshop and it's why some tournaments require you use the mice, keyboards, and headsets they provide. So, how does this tie in to the future of FF? Although FF will be moving to a new engine, this game should not have any sort of non-map user content creation. That is to say, if the U4 engine has the ability to have a Steam Workshop styled thing, don't do it. Don't allow Steam Workshop to be a thing with this mod. Don't allow the Steam Workshop to be a thing with Source 2. Do not allow leagues to host your game if they don't actively work against hackers (I'm looking at UCG). Actively seek out those who are not on the up-and-up. The days of the auto-snap aimbot are long, long gone. The modern face of hacking is very clever and very subtle. No game has been exempt from it, and FF was not exception. We will see in the next few months the face of online competitive gaming, at least in FPS, change dramatically. __________________ "The nine most terrifying words in the English language are: 'I'm from the government and I'm here to help.'" Ronald Reagan

11-22-2014, 10:04 AM	#2
FDA_Approved Beta Tester Join Date: Nov 2011 Gametype: Capture the Flag Posts Rated Helpful 293 Times	TL;DR version: Cheaters be cheating, except this time it's the end of the world, and we can't have nice things anymore. Except for not really, chill out. __________________ Currently equipped: Rad Scarf of liberating happiness.

11-23-2014, 12:11 PM	#5
homie in reboks' Join Date: Jun 2011 Location: USA Class/Position: Soldier & Medic Affiliations: ( ir :: ) iv\| K^ † Posts Rated Helpful 80 Times	This is only important in CS:GO because it's professional players that are likely cheating at LAN event with prize pools of $250K. There's very little incentive to cheat at FF. No one will be wasting their time making cheats for FF that operate in this manner. Why? Because there are no FF LAN events and there are no prize pools of $10 let alone $250K. Also, this is basically just a regurgitation of the /r/GlobalOffensive thread. __________________

11-23-2014, 06:49 PM	#8
KubeDawg Nade Whore Server Owner Beta Tester Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Oklahoma Class/Position: Scout/Soldier Gametype: CTF/TDM Affiliations: blunt. Moto Posts Rated Helpful 128 Times	I thought all the 1 and 2 digit accounts were basically all Valve employees/developers. In any case, this likely will have 0 effect on FF, even if there is some major spark in play once released on Steam and Steam Workshop is open, I really doubt much will come of it. I understand there are much more subtle ways for someone to cheat these days, so as to avoid detection, but I'm of the opinion that if you are clever enough to not get caught with a cheat, then who really cares? In the grand scheme of things, it's just a video game. Though I'd probably cheat too if I knew I had a decent chance at a $250k prize pool in CS:GO hah, but I'm probably at the opposite of the skill spectrum and cheats would not help me at all. __________________ Moto's Funhouse \| Dallas, TX - 74.91.114.247:27015 ff_plunder - Complete

11-22-2014, 06:25 PM	#3
AfterShock Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts Rated Helpful 45 Times	Until valve just starts noticing and bans all the accounts, because they run steam workshop and probably have all the data they need.

11-23-2014, 12:33 PM	#7
AfterShock Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Mar 2007 Posts Rated Helpful 45 Times	reading that thread, there were a few top players using a complex cheat, and they got found out and VAC banned, along with their 2 digit steamID accounts worth £10k Doesn't sound like cheaters are winning to me. Anyone who wants to code a cheat purely for FF would probably be better off joining the dev team and coding features for the game instead..

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