Bunny Hopping (Bhoping)

[o_little dragon]

Ok me and some friends where talkin about FF and about some of the Dev notes, saying that Bhopin will be alowed, why? it is not a natural thing, it increases the speeds of classes that where ment to go the speed they where made at, example, the HW is supposed to be really slow because well he's fat. Why is Bhoping going to be in FF?

**(( And Circuitous please be nice, no need for ignorant comments from you, I would jsut like an answer to my questions))**

[Circuitous]

My comments are usually the opposite of ignorant in this case. Let me hit you with some knowledge.

Bunnyhopping is allowed because, if you look at clan play, it's omnipresent. There's a good reason for this, too - when you get to high-level league play in these games, maneuverability is key. Bunnyhopping is the pinnacle of movement - it allows speed and turning potential you couldn't get just by running. Now, on less organized games, it's easy enough to get away without jumping much. You're not dealing with potential lockdowns there, and it's easy enough to just shuck and jive, but when you get higher up the ladder, so to speak, it's just... it don't work. The bunnyhopping is capped based on class speed, so there's no fear of HWGuys outrunning Medics outrunning Scouts.

Now, then. With bhopping being intentionally included in the game... I mean, how is it unnatural? It's there, it's intentional. IT'S AS GOD INTENDED.

We could get more detailed, if that's not sufficient for you.

[Jiggles]

Short answer: because bhopping is fun.

If you want to see the longer answer, the search tool could probably find a whole ton of related threads.

[o_deadpool]

i dont really think i can imagine tfc without bhopping anymore. i remember the first time i saw |KoD|the_rock in a pub bhoping i was like "wtf that is insane! i'll never be able to do it... hax!" but the more i played i got the feel of it and its just a thing you do now, every game(engine) has its quarks but they turn out to make it into a skill that needs to be attained and in the long run make it more fun (usually).

[o_littleandroidman]

I think bhopping should be just as hard to master in FF as it was in TFC. Instead of pressing a button, and it enabling, the physics should be exactly the same. It took me forever to learn to bhop, and now I'm just going to need to press a button? Kind of defeats the purpose of the game. And that purpose is to perfect your skills.

[o_ekim]

Originally Posted by Little Dragon

it is not a natural thing, it increases the speeds of classes that where ment to go the speed they where made at, example, the HW is supposed to be really slow because well he's fat.

Actualy, the dev team are including bunnyhopping on purpose. It's not an accident. So classes are "meant" to use it. Besides, the HWGuy is still nowhere near as speedy as other classes a) his speed cap is lower (it's proportional to wlaking speed) and b) he starts bhopping from his walking speed, so it takes him longer to build up speed. The HWGuy is still really slow compared to other classes. If you don't think he is, I guess you don't know a lot about bunnyhopping.

[o_afx]

Also let us not forget, that if valve didnt want us to bhop, then it wouldnt have been beyond then to totally remove it from tfc, as opposed to limiting it to 170% of a classes speed, The fact is, its not a bug or an exploit anymore, its an intended and accepted part of the game, and thus will be so in FF too.

Im not trying to be disrespectful, but it does seem that most of the people who are anti bhopping, are generally older pub players, who play on their one specific server, probably with a bunch of other people who cant bhop. And then get all pissy about it when a clanner pops on, bhopping all over the place, and cos they aren't used to it they get annoyed at not being able to hit that player and see it as a cheat. And then try and use this as a reason why nobody should bhop. When in actuality, the simplest answer is to ban bhopping and bhoppers on your server and stick to your slow old fart version of team fortress ...hmm maybe that was disrespectful after all, sorry

TF is a fast, fun, unrealistic game, i dont know why anyone would want to slow it down.

[o_bokko]

i bhope youre kidding

[o_fooleycooley]

Originally Posted by LittleAndroidMan

I think bhopping should be just as hard to master in FF as it was in TFC. Instead of pressing a button, and it enabling, the physics should be exactly the same. It took me forever to learn to bhop, and now I'm just going to need to press a button? Kind of defeats the purpose of the game. And that purpose is to perfect your skills.

You don't just 'press a button' and it does it for you in FF.

All FF's system does over TFC is remove the need for a jump script and makes the timing of pressing jump more forgiving. Everything else - the turning and strafing - is exactly the same.

I gotta wonder where you guys get your misinformation from. ;D

[o_ghost]

[o_mikefed]

Originally Posted by Jiggles

Short answer: because bhopping is fun.

Exactly! Nothing else to it really, cept for the fact that if bhop was removed like 90% of TFCers wouldn't bother playing it I know I wouldn't.

[o_goldplatypus]

lol [DAD] clan hahaahha lol. I think everybody and their mother has been banned there for bhopping.

[o_zaskar]

Bhopping is a exploit of any physics engine, one that was heavily adopted, but it still is using an exploit of air move speed.

It is used in clan play to make up for an imbalance, one that without bhopping makes defence too strong, thats a balance problem, not a reason to keep it.

In the end its just "but but, i spent all that time learning it... you have to include it"

and

Originally Posted by MikeFed

Exactly! Nothing else to it really, cept for the fact that if bhop was removed like 90% of TFCers wouldn't bother playing it I know I wouldn't.

ehh, its gonna turn off a lot more new players when they say some guy is speed hacking and then the others tell him he is a noob and thats part of the game, and their also not gonna tell him how to do it.

Originally Posted by Afx

Also let us not forget, that if valve didnt want us to bhop, then it wouldnt have been beyond then to totally remove it from tfc, as opposed to limiting it to 170% of a classes speed, The fact is, its not a bug or an exploit anymore, its an intended and accepted part of the game, and thus will be so in FF too.

They did that cause so many people used it. Just like that sliding crap in Tribes. I mean, by beloved Nail sploit is the same, its STILL in there. That means its now ok to consider intentional right. I mean it took allot of time to perfect on the run knowing every spot to blow people up in various spots.

Nothing better then blowing a sniper up on the battlements in 2fort and then getting him with one just as he respawns. Awsome death from below.

i really dont care, but saying 1 of those is a exploit and 1 is totally OK is ignorance. thwer bolth sploits, but after a while bhopping was just so widly used it got taken in as a staple in gameplay. Doesnt change where its origon was.

Be nice to see defence modified so that the clan matches werent just based on who had the best set of Bhoppin offence.

[o_silencer]

deadpool im probably one of the only people here that knows of |KoD|the_ROCK besides some of the devs... haha its always fun to hear names from the way past... i used to love pubbing in the KoD Dugeon of Death or something along those lines.

[o_frenchtoast]

Originally Posted by Little Dragon

**(( And Circuitous please be nice, no need for ignorant comments from you, I would jsut like an answer to my questions))**

haha, funniest thing I've read on the forums.

[o_zaskar]

Originally Posted by FrenchToast

haha, funniest thing I've read on the forums.

Lol yea, tellin Circ not to be mean or a wiseass is like tellin Fat guys not to eat cake or icecream.

[o_ekim]

I'm of the opinion that Zaskar can't bunnyhop very well.

[o_kastofsna]

Originally Posted by Zaskar

Lol yea, tellin Circ not to be mean or a wiseass is like tellin Fat guys not to eat cake or icecream.

[o_zaskar]

Originally Posted by ekiM

I'm of the opinion that Zaskar can't bunnyhop very well.

Your right, Aside from straight lines i cant very well. I cant conc more then a single either, doesnt mean i want that removed or change it. Same with many other classic TFC skill moves. People who cant Nail nade sploit very well still want it removed. Its compleatly besids the point.

[PHISH]

Originally Posted by Zaskar

Bhopping is a exploit of any physics engine, one that was heavily adopted, but it still is using an exploit of air move speed.

It is used in clan play to make up for an imbalance, one that without bhopping makes defence too strong, thats a balance problem, not a reason to keep it.

First of all yes its an exploit of the original quake engine, many things were and its a moot point. But your comment that "it is used in clan play to make up for an imbalance"- is not true at all, I don't know where you drew this conclusion. Defense is open to the same capabilities as well, and new "bhoppers" are very predictable more so than someone who fakes well without bunnyhopping. There was a time period when bhopping was banned (before being capped) in most of the upper tier leagues, it didn't radically shift who was good and who wasn't. In fact it didn't change anything at all, other than taking a few movement skill capabilities away from players. Even now that bhopping is back in- although capped proportional to class speed, the best offensive players aren't necessarily the best bhoppers.

ehh, its gonna turn off a lot more new players when they say some guy is speed hacking and then the others tell him he is a noob and thats part of the game, and their also not gonna tell him how to do it.

They already discussed a training program that will walk you through the classes, weapon, conc jumping and some of advanced movement (basic bhopping). So this will be not only known to the new player, they will have the opportunity to learn how to do it.

They did that cause so many people used it. Just like that sliding crap in Tribes. I mean, by beloved Nail sploit is the same, its STILL in there. That means its now ok to consider intentional right. I mean it took allot of time to perfect on the run knowing every spot to blow people up in various spots.

Please don't attempt to make analogies ever again...this is wrong on so many levels. The first of which that valve actually recognized the nail exploit as something they were going to fix- but they never did. A lack of action doesn't mean anything.

Be nice to see defence modified so that the clan matches werent just based on who had the best set of Bhoppin offence.

It isn't- at all, whoever has the best movement to fake out defenders is obviously an asset to the offense, but this doesn't have to involve bhopping at all, strafe/glide jumping, doing a simple air curl, wallstrafing and just doing regular strafing on the ground without being predictable. Some of the best offensive players don't bhop during combat at all. If you bhop everywhere it gives you away and defenders will tear you up.