Disabling Flag-carrier Resupply?

cjeshjoir™ · 11-18-2009, 05:51 PM

tl;dr: Disable resupply acquisition when for the flag carrier (feature request: option to disable)

Why should the flag carrier be able to get resupply bags?
What consequences does this have on gameplay (specifically capping the flag)?

Running excitedly back to my base carrying the flag is so much fun! I enjoy it, truly. The reason I enjoy it is because I know I'm the target, the focus of the entire opposing team. Their number one priority shifts from defense to DESTROY THAT DUDE WITH THE FLAG with just a simple proclamation from a rather rugged announcer.

As I happily bounce back to my base, I often notice that I've been shot, blown up, or (if I'm really lucky) stabbed a few times on my way. Passing by the spawn doors, I ponder, "should I go get some more health and armour?" I quickly dismiss the thought, as this would ruin the excitement of the chase, the work of the entire opposing team would be for naught. I continue on towards the cap point, knowing full well that my chances of survival are reduced significantly.

The teamplay-inducing properties of a simple tweak such as this would benefit game play, in my mind and put quite simply, a lot. Medics given a reason to heal me? Hells yes. Engineers spanning my face for armor? Yes pls! Everyone else on the team stepping into the line of fire for my sake and the sake of the flag we are all so fond of? Oh my gosh, am I dreaming <3? Chase me, my other-colored-brothers, chase me ALL THE WAY TO THE CAP POINT, for you still have a chance to redeem your trophy, your similarly-colored flag!

Need I say more?

MonoXideAtWork · 11-18-2009, 07:08 PM

I like the arena gametype for these reasons!

Dr.Satan · 11-19-2009, 06:53 AM

I'm confused...are you requesting information on how to do this? b/c it's quite easily done via lua...or are you asking that we implement this on all maps?

Also I agree with 98% of what you said...all except for the engy spamming part b/c that would just end up with them blocking you from capping and 9/10 times a loss of the cap. So yeah, medpacks sure...but everything else, nah.

Iggy · 11-19-2009, 10:30 AM

This is a non-issue in league play, as O v O is generally frowned upon. In pub play, it would change the dynamic of the game, and not always for the better:

It could result in the person who fought for the flag to lose it, to someone who didn't "earn" it. Cap theft is a demoralizing thing. Granted, it's a TEAM game, but not everyone sees it that way. I understand cjeshjoir's point, but at it stands, he has the option to "keep it exciting" and simply not enter resapwn.

cjeshjoir™ · 12-20-2009, 09:05 AM

This issue came up again while Pon was modding the LUA for my port of Flagrun. The possibility of holding the flag in the spawn area and delaying the game indefinitely became a potential issue. Implementing a way to clip flag carriers (or respawn the flag upon entering a trigger via LUA (which is the method we chose)) should be considered for a future release.

PS:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Iggy

...league play...

Gross.

Dr.Satan · 12-21-2009, 07:48 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cjeshjoir™

(or respawn the flag upon entering a trigger via LUA (which is the method we chose)) should be considered for a future release.

I'm confused...that is possible, so what are you asking for exactly? If your just wanting to know how you can do that (stop a player from going into the resup with the flag), then that's simple to do.

cjeshjoir™ · 12-21-2009, 09:04 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr.Satan

I'm confused...that is possible, so what are you asking for exactly? If your just wanting to know how you can do that (stop a player from going into the resup with the flag), then that's simple to do.

I was saying that, ideally, the flag carrier should not be allowed into the respawn area. This is not the same as disabling the ability for the flag carrier to resupply... he should be blocked from entering the resupply area. The first reason was because he could resupply, which would make the people chasing him give up. The second was that the carrier could potentially hold the flag like a llama in the resupply area and delay the game indefinitely.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr.Satan

Also I agree with 98% of what you said...all except for the engy spamming part

Twas a little joke; everything after tl;dr was for giggles.

Hawk Eye · 12-21-2009, 09:29 AM

Considering Team-Only doors are coded via LUA, I'd assume you could also add another stipulation to the code refusing entry if player is holding a flag. (or even have Spawn Room Turrets attack them should they sneak past)

cjeshjoir™ · 12-21-2009, 10:57 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hawk Eye

Considering Team-Only doors are coded via LUA, I'd assume you could also add another stipulation to the code refusing entry if player is holding a flag. (or even have Spawn Room Turrets attack them should they sneak past)

Someone could open the door for them, and I believe the turrets wont target individual players, but only teams.

Dr.Satan · 12-21-2009, 06:34 PM

I'm not sure that you can make a wall toggle. Like I think the closest you would get is the solution you have now where you simply can't enter the noannoyances (or whatever trigger you tied it to) with the flag, and if you try it gets sent "home"

GenghisTron · 12-21-2009, 06:37 PM

Flag clip!

cjeshjoir™ · 12-21-2009, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr.Satan

I'm not sure that you can make a wall toggle. Like I think the closest you would get is the solution you have now where you simply can't enter the noannoyances (or whatever trigger you tied it to) with the flag, and if you try it gets sent "home"

Speaking of noannoyances... I haven't gotten them to work... Am I doin it wrong?

Dr.Satan · 12-21-2009, 06:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cjeshjoir™

Speaking of noannoyances... I haven't gotten them to work... Am I doin it wrong?

yes

what are you doing?

cjeshjoir™ · 12-21-2009, 06:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Dr.Satan

yes

what are you doing?

Trigger_ff_script volume named noannoyances covering an area

**Elmo** · 12-21-2009, 08:13 PM

make sure the flags section of the entity has the right things set (e.g. ff buildables n grenades n stuff)

cant remember what's needed

cjeshjoir™ · 12-22-2009, 07:59 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Elmo

make sure the flags section of the entity has the right things set (e.g. ff buildables n grenades n stuff)

cant remember what's needed

Oh, duh. I assumed it would work regardless, but now that makes sense.

Dr.Satan · 12-22-2009, 08:44 AM

yeah, I also had that problem when first using them. I always select:

clients
everything
ff grenades
ff buildables

not sure which of those [I]have/I] to be selected, but I know for sure that they work with those ones.

**Elmo** · 12-22-2009, 01:19 PM

yeah, same deal with me guys.. Didn't realise that either (before I found out from someone else!)

11-18-2009, 05:51 PM	#1
cjeshjoir™ 1-800-UNAGIPOWA Join Date: Nov 2009 Location: California, USA Gametype: AvD, Spirit of TFC Affiliations: ™.AvD Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Disabling Flag-carrier Resupply? tl;dr: Disable resupply acquisition when for the flag carrier (feature request: option to disable) Why should the flag carrier be able to get resupply bags? What consequences does this have on gameplay (specifically capping the flag)? Running excitedly back to my base carrying the flag is so much fun! I enjoy it, truly. The reason I enjoy it is because I know I'm the target, the focus of the entire opposing team. Their number one priority shifts from defense to DESTROY THAT DUDE WITH THE FLAG with just a simple proclamation from a rather rugged announcer. As I happily bounce back to my base, I often notice that I've been shot, blown up, or (if I'm really lucky) stabbed a few times on my way. Passing by the spawn doors, I ponder, "should I go get some more health and armour?" I quickly dismiss the thought, as this would ruin the excitement of the chase, the work of the entire opposing team would be for naught. I continue on towards the cap point, knowing full well that my chances of survival are reduced significantly. The teamplay-inducing properties of a simple tweak such as this would benefit game play, in my mind and put quite simply, a lot. Medics given a reason to heal me? Hells yes. Engineers spanning my face for armor? Yes pls! Everyone else on the team stepping into the line of fire for my sake and the sake of the flag we are all so fond of? Oh my gosh, am I dreaming <3? Chase me, my other-colored-brothers, chase me ALL THE WAY TO THE CAP POINT, for you still have a chance to redeem your trophy, your similarly-colored flag! Need I say more? __________________ " In my opinion the testing team isn't really made for or of public players, it's made for competative players... " ¹ -Scuzzy (post# 462713) Last edited by cjeshjoir™; 11-18-2009 at 05:52 PM. Reason: typo

11-19-2009, 06:53 AM	#3
Dr.Satan Wiki Team Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Greeley, CO Class/Position: Med / Solly Gametype: PAYLOAD Affiliations: DET- Posts Rated Helpful 19 Times	I'm confused...are you requesting information on how to do this? b/c it's quite easily done via lua...or are you asking that we implement this on all maps? Also I agree with 98% of what you said...all except for the engy spamming part b/c that would just end up with them blocking you from capping and 9/10 times a loss of the cap. So yeah, medpacks sure...but everything else, nah. __________________ FF Community Map Pack(s): 1 / 2 (Released) conc_school \| hellion_classic \| ksour_PAYLOAD \| mulch_faf (Beta) alchimy_b1 (Lua) base_payload_2015 (Models) props_trainyard Support FF:

12-21-2009, 06:34 PM	#10
Dr.Satan Wiki Team Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Greeley, CO Class/Position: Med / Solly Gametype: PAYLOAD Affiliations: DET- Posts Rated Helpful 19 Times	I'm not sure that you can make a wall toggle. Like I think the closest you would get is the solution you have now where you simply can't enter the noannoyances (or whatever trigger you tied it to) with the flag, and if you try it gets sent "home" __________________ FF Community Map Pack(s): 1 / 2 (Released) conc_school \| hellion_classic \| ksour_PAYLOAD \| mulch_faf (Beta) alchimy_b1 (Lua) base_payload_2015 (Models) props_trainyard Support FF:

12-21-2009, 06:37 PM	#11
GenghisTron AKA LittleAndroidMan D&A Member Beta Tester Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Dystopia Class/Position: Demo/Medic Gametype: CTF Affiliations: [TALOS] [SR] Posts Rated Helpful 11 Times	Flag clip! __________________ The Catacombs Steam Last.fm

12-21-2009, 08:13 PM	#15
Elmo Gets tickled by FF Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: UK Class/Position: Med Solly HW Gametype: Any/CTF Posts Rated Helpful 41 Times	make sure the flags section of the entity has the right things set (e.g. ff buildables n grenades n stuff) cant remember what's needed __________________ Support FF: Done: ff_monkey Done: ff_bases Done: ff_warpath Forever Doing: ff_medieval (beta#99999999)

11-18-2009, 07:08 PM	#2
MonoXideAtWork Pub Allstar! Beta Tester Join Date: Aug 2008 Class/Position: under en kvinna Gametype: Capture the Flag Affiliations: Eternal Order, Must be h4x, Mono's happy funtime. Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	I like the arena gametype for these reasons!

12-21-2009, 09:29 AM	#8
Hawk Eye Who the fuck is this guy? D&A Member Beta Tester Join Date: Mar 2007 Class/Position: O Preferred Gametype: AvD Affiliations: [AE] Asseaters Posts Rated Helpful 2 Times	Considering Team-Only doors are coded via LUA, I'd assume you could also add another stipulation to the code refusing entry if player is holding a flag. (or even have Spawn Room Turrets attack them should they sneak past)

12-22-2009, 08:44 AM	#17
Dr.Satan Wiki Team Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Sep 2007 Location: Greeley, CO Class/Position: Med / Solly Gametype: PAYLOAD Affiliations: DET- Posts Rated Helpful 19 Times	yeah, I also had that problem when first using them. I always select: clients everything ff grenades ff buildables not sure which of those [I]have/I] to be selected, but I know for sure that they work with those ones. __________________ FF Community Map Pack(s): 1 / 2 (Released) conc_school \| hellion_classic \| ksour_PAYLOAD \| mulch_faf (Beta) alchimy_b1 (Lua) base_payload_2015 (Models) props_trainyard Support FF:

12-22-2009, 01:19 PM	#18
Elmo Gets tickled by FF Fortress Forever Staff Join Date: Jun 2007 Location: UK Class/Position: Med Solly HW Gametype: Any/CTF Posts Rated Helpful 41 Times	yeah, same deal with me guys.. Didn't realise that either (before I found out from someone else!) __________________ Support FF: Done: ff_monkey Done: ff_bases Done: ff_warpath Forever Doing: ff_medieval (beta#99999999)

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