O_o

[Etzell]

Originally Posted by Bridget

Both of the admins apologized, if I recall. Whether or not they were sincere is irrelevant, you can at-least be mature enough to drop the grudges and just get over it. Give them, if they were insincere, something to think about. Right? Well, probably not. You don't really give a shit, huh? I bet you're fond of the bullshit and are upset to see it go.

I don't care about an apology if nothing changes. Both admins apologized and were back to their old tricks in the same threads. I never asked for an apology, and, frankly, I didn't want one. I wanted, and still do want, the admins to behave differently.

[[AE] 82694]

Originally Posted by uBeR

Take a look at the stated reason by "The Fortress Forever Development Team" representative. The stated reason is, "it will be very easy to point out" those responsible for "instigating, accusing, and being a general problem."

This will go for us also if we are the problem. I'm not worried.

[uBeR]

Of course you're not worried. That's the point.

[Bridget]

Nope! I'm just taking hold of that opportunity to stop acting like a dick and start anew, the same opportunity you guys have been offered, but are giving up to perpetuate grudges and other bullshit — the things you used to complain about.

It seems like now that the administrative team has come up with some form of a solution, a fair opportunity for everyone to rebuild their reputation and to get a second chance, you no longer have anything to bitch about, yet are desperate to find a reason to do just that. D'aw!

I question again: Do you actually care about bettering these forums or was the drama (Presumed dead, I don't see anything wrong with how specific admins have been handling the situation thus far, so we know who is trying to revive it.) the motivating factor for you logging in to these forums? It seems the latter. Let's be honest, Fortress Forever is not the reason you log in.

[FrenchToast]

Originally Posted by [AE] 82694

This will go for us also if we are the problem. I'm not worried.

Then you'll be changing this forum rule;


The following rules apply to regular non-mod/dev team forum members:

?

[Scuzzy]

Originally Posted by FrenchToast

Then you'll be changing this forum rule;


The following rules apply to regular non-mod/dev team forum members:

?

We are still discussing the forum rules. If any changes are made the general population will be notified. Until that time anyone who has joined the D&A group are bound by the rules when they post in this section.

Scuzzy

[FrenchToast]

Anyone except those with administrative powers.

[[AE] 82694]

With the recent events we have hashed out a lot of stuff to try to make our forums a better place. So my suggestion is to relax and let us do that.

[FrenchToast]

Juuuuuuuuuuuust trying to get some things clarified. Far be it from me to suggest you're doing anything other than making the forums better.

[Scuzzy]

Originally Posted by FrenchToast

Juuuuuuuuuuuust trying to get some things clarified. Far be it from me to suggest you're doing anything other than making the forums better.

For clarification, the only individual you need to worry about following the rules or who the rules apply to is yourself. If you're unsure if you should post something, don't. If you need more clarification on the rules as they apply to you, please ask us directly in the Player to Team Communication section of the forums.

Scuzzy

[FrenchToast]

Originally Posted by Scuzzy

For clarification, the only individual you need to worry about following the rules or who the rules apply to is yourself.

I think that's a poor philosophy.

[Scuzzy]

Originally Posted by FrenchToast

I think that's a poor philosophy.

I would disagree.

[FrenchToast]

Look! We're debating!

[Bridget]

It's good advice, because if you worry about yourself and adhering to the rules, and someone else is causing trouble, there's no delay in coming to an objective conclusion as to who is being such a problem. Whereas, if two people are bickering and bitching, it could take some time to figure out who's the aggressor and who's the victim — if not both the aggressor with no victim. You would be apt to complain about 'nothing getting done' during this time of decision. Worrying about everyone else causes everyone to point the finger at one another, causing drama, and complicating the situation.

[FrenchToast]

I think only worrying about yourself allows abuses of powers the likes of which are commonplace around here, and creates passivity on otherwise important issues. Only worrying about yourself is a shit strategy on these forums, and a pathetic strategy in life. See: The United States for further information.

[uBeR]

FrenchToast, some people from bygone ages were brought up, taught, or otherwise indoctrinated to leave authority unquestioned. "Obedience and discipline" were the desideratum of society. (As an aside, you might call this "the educational system" in modern nomenclature.) You don't "need to worry about" who "the rules apply to." (For obvious reasons, of course.) Even raising these kinds of questions might been seen as "complicating" things; you're supposed be controlled as efficiently as possible, not "complicating" things and "causing drama." Yes, that's the type of culture some people have grown up and still immerse themselves in. I also find it to be a rather perverse culture, a "poor philosophy" generally, and the reason we're even having this discussion, to be sure.

[Bridget]

There is a difference between behaving yourself so that those who are problematic are blatant in their actions and easily taken care of and general selfishness. As far as I can tell, the other administrative members and the development team are not pleased with what has been going on, and will therefore be more likely to take care of problems in the future, whether normal member or even admin abuse.

That's the problem, though, you're not allowing this 'change' to run its course before judging it. I haven't seen any admin abuse or double standards, so I don't know what people are complaining about. Meanwhile, I will embrace the second chance, while you guys cling to the bitter way things used to be.

[[AE] 82694]

Some people fear change, and don't want to give anybody a chance or they loose their sole purpose for coming here.

[FrenchToast]

Originally Posted by Bridget

whether normal member or even admin abuse.

And yet, the forums rules don't outline any that admins need to obey. Do you not take issue with that?

Perhaps if you haven't seen the double standards or abuses of power, you are unfit to comment on issues regarding them.

EDIT:

Originally Posted by [AE] 82694

Some people fear change, and don't want to give anybody a chance or they loose their sole purpose for coming here.

Some people don't want to admit their obvious faults and failures in their duties, and do things like erasing entire forum section to avoid doing so.

[Bridget]

Originally Posted by FrenchToast

And yet, the forums rules don't outline any that admins need to obey. Do you not take issue with that?

Perhaps if you haven't seen the double standards or abuses of power, you are unfit to comment on issues regarding them.

I should elaborate that I haven't seen any double standards or abuses of power since this subforum has been refreshed. You seem to be thinking that the forum rules need to state that the administrative powers are being held to some standard for them to actually be held to a standard. Perhaps they are being held to a standard higher than the normal member? Maybe more is being expected of them that doesn't need to be addressed in public? Ignorance of x is not the non-existence of x.

I imagine it's not sun shine, fields of flowers, and showers of candy for them right now either, given the dramatic change that has taken place for the D&A forum as a result of their behavior as well as our own (Everyone's at fault! Intellectual honesty works wonders!) If they are a problem, let them be a problem, so that they can easily be taken care of. If you worry about yourself, then when someone trips up, they can be dealt with without the administration having to sift through 'he said she said' nonsense. But, as I said, I haven't seen any problems yet.

EDIT: As stated, this subforum was not erased to cover up evidence, but because of evidence. It was probably too much of a fucking embarrassment for all of us. Know that not only we read that which was whined about on these forums, but every potential member getting a 'glimpse' at this game's community. You know, the game? Fortress Forever? The reason this forum exists. The chance at starting over was given to everyone, that includes you too, so I would suggest taking it and dealing with actual problems when they actually come up. Grudges are for children and so is this malicious request for revenge. Move on. Get over it.