ff_anticitizen (not cacti anymore) - Page 10

o_addicted to morphine · 07-09-2006, 05:57 AM

I've skimmed this entire thread, and I wanted to share a few thoughts I had about the visuals.

From what I could tell from the screens, the mapping of the outside areas are really tight, really clean, and they have an amazing look to them. I feel like a sense of negative space is very important when it comes to how a map looks and feels ( I swear to god I'm not as full of it as it may seem from that last comment

) and I think you utilize negative space very well in your outdoor stages. I look at them, and I just see a freedom to conc and rj to my hearts content, and while attack maps get spammy, the outdoor areas give me the impression that with a good conc I could soar above all the conflag. I've never seen a screenshot that actually conjured dancing images of gameplay in my head before, so hey... that's a good sign, right?

From what I've gathered, you haven't done a serious pass at the 2nd stage yet, but from that one screenshot I was a little scared. In contrast to the outdoor areas, your indoor areas seem dark and cramped. While variety helps, I feel like you could stand to blow it out with some more light, and make the areas larger in general. I feel like concing and rjing, just from that shot, would be severely limited. Since you need an elevator to reach the 3rd stage, I'm assuming the second is deep underground... but even so I'd love to see some roofs just ripped off to get some sunlight (and negative space) in there.

Also, I enjoy the curviness of the windows and the towers in general, and so, in contrast, the 2nd shot you posted (on the first page) of the spawn point looks jagged, and ultra angled (especially the floor).

On D, I can't wait to set up my SG on top of the little cliff next to the elevator, and on O, I can't wait to RJ from there to the cliff right above and annoy the defenders from behind.

Anyway -- I think you've got great talent, and I really enjoy all your outdoor shots. I hope you see this map through to the end.

o_tyrus · 07-17-2006, 09:24 PM

Not trying to be a sucker, but I think Nezumi is probably the best mapper here! All your maps are great looking so far. Can't wait to play them!

o_filter · 07-17-2006, 11:10 PM

Looks nice, cant wait to try it out

Circuitous · 07-18-2006, 05:56 AM

NEZUMI'S A CHUMP.

o_nezumi · 07-18-2006, 06:06 AM

YO SHUT UP CIRC DON'T MAKE ME COME IN THERE!!

Hey, thanks for the comments guys.

Morphine, yes the second part is cramped now, especially for an AvD map. I'm seriously reconsidering a lot of the parts I have built (although some are really cool) to make it less 'corridor' and more 'courtyard'.
There's one awkward part now that has the attacking team riding up an elevator, but the elevators are kinda like well FR style things where you get on and they lift up, but there's no real way down but to jump. The offence has the option of completely ignoring this route and going around but this way looks way cooler so I'm going to see if I can do anything more intuitive with that room.

And all of the second part is going to be brighter than that first screenshot I showed.

Tbh I haven't worked on this map pretty much at all since the last screenshot. I've been in a kind of "sit around in a bathrobe drinking mountain dew all day" kinda mood recently. Bah! To hell with that. Spamming the forums can wait too. I'm gonna see if I can't get the second stage connected to the third tonight. *starts arranging winamp playlist*

o_addicted to morphine · 07-18-2006, 07:19 AM

Well good luck with that, looking forward to progress and screenshots.

Circuitous · 07-18-2006, 07:30 AM

I DARE YOU TO COME IN HERE.

Circuitous · 07-19-2006, 02:36 AM

What? Chinese people love me, you're crazy.

o_nezumi · 07-19-2006, 03:39 PM

*puts on best villain voice*

Kyle Katarn!

o_nezumi · 08-21-2006, 07:57 PM

News: Cacti isn't dead.

The middle section is almost finished. I can fairly confidently say that I've done a rought pass of the entire map except for the lighting in 2 rooms in the middle section. After that it's all tweaks baby.

Of course, that's the tedious part but it shouldn't be too bad with this map.

The middle section turned out to be quite a bit longer than I thought it would. It takes about 50 seconds to run (not bhop or anything) through it, whereas the first section takes 30 seconds and the 3rd takes 40 (although only 20 to run down, hehe).

This means that the map is a bit longer than dustbowl, which was about 30 seconds for each section. The middle section may be way too easy to defend. It's all indoors so there's less opportunities for rocket/conc jumping, and there are a lot of choke points. If I position the grenades fairly close to the attackers, all the choke points should work in their favor though. There's also a lot of branching paths so the defenders are split, etc....

The good news too is that the map HASN'T run into any max_anything problems, runs smoothly throughout, I think, and is only 30 megs (without any files bsp-zipped). So this just might work out after all.

o_bumgravy · 08-21-2006, 08:15 PM

When u say x secs to run, remember that classes in FF will be different speeds than in TFC. Have u considered that when timing the runs?

o_ma|2io · 08-21-2006, 09:48 PM

Good. Some complain ADLers complain that, "All adl is now is if you have a good demo and sniper you win." Looks like cap 2 will eliminate some of that because of good ol' DM.

o_industrial · 08-22-2006, 12:36 AM

Hey man I love this map especially the mountain part, but I have a few suggestions wich would make it a little more balanced towards the attacking team imho.

The first thing youll notice is the ladder to the left, I think thats fair, nice thingy for spies to quickly mingle with the defence and start chopping etc :P
The boxes would allow for _some_ defence as its 0 ATM
The hole in building, well, sg!

just my 2 cents

o_nezumi · 08-22-2006, 02:21 PM

I may put the ladder there just to make things more interesting. It'd offer the offence another way up, and it'd allow the defense a faster way down without taking damage.

I think an SG in the hole you've drawn in that building would be out of range of most things and just get taken out from long range.

If there indeed isn't enough cover in this area I could put some rock props where those boxes are pretty easily.

Mulchman MM · 08-22-2006, 02:28 PM

i'd add some chokepoint/vis blocker at the top of that hill before even getting back to the "rock bridge" part

o_yohan1973 · 09-05-2006, 11:23 PM

Nice! Your spawn room kinda reminds me of what I was working on last year befor I stopped.
http://img32.imageshack.us/my.php?im...ge200001by.jpg

That was in this thread
http://forums.fortress-forever.com/s...?t=2597&page=3

I like your lighting in it so far!
Your exterior looks real good too!
Good job!!!!!!!

Edit: Skip the good job comment! It's freak'n awsome!!!!!!
Dude You have SKILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

o_ma|2io · 09-09-2006, 03:12 AM

New screenies? Or did you go like, "too much work, im gonna pour some pop in my computer." then cry after losing your map.

o_nezumi · 09-09-2006, 04:36 AM

What caused me to pour poop on my computer was almost having to move out of my apartment, and trying to find a job/sign up for classes. I'm gonna try to get some more screens out this weekend.

I'm also kinda supposed to be making changes to a CS:S map of mine for CAL, but that just requires a recompile untill everyone finds something else about the map to whine about. Those people are picky (not that I can blame them).

And now that we've seen the dustbowl textures, I have to say that they look like they will be satisfactory for cacti. So everyone imagine this map with the ff_dustbowl dust/rock textures untill they actually release them.

o_ma|2io · 09-09-2006, 06:41 PM

Pffft screw real life.

Lost · 09-10-2006, 04:18 AM

Well, you have to screw in real life, cuz it don't really work virtually.

Yet.

07-18-2006, 05:56 AM	#184
Circuitous Useless Retired FF Staff Join Date: Jun 2005 Class/Position: D Soldier, O Scout Gametype: AvD Posts Rated Helpful 9 Times	NEZUMI'S A CHUMP. __________________ Look at all those dead links.

07-18-2006, 07:30 AM	#187
Circuitous Useless Retired FF Staff Join Date: Jun 2005 Class/Position: D Soldier, O Scout Gametype: AvD Posts Rated Helpful 9 Times	I DARE YOU TO COME IN HERE. __________________ Look at all those dead links.

07-19-2006, 02:36 AM	#188
Circuitous Useless Retired FF Staff Join Date: Jun 2005 Class/Position: D Soldier, O Scout Gametype: AvD Posts Rated Helpful 9 Times	What? Chinese people love me, you're crazy. __________________ Look at all those dead links.

08-22-2006, 02:28 PM	#195
Mulchman MM Retired FF Staff Join Date: Dec 2004 Location: Lacey, WA Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	i'd add some chokepoint/vis blocker at the top of that hill before even getting back to the "rock bridge" part __________________ Head of the Orca Revolution (TM)

09-05-2006, 11:23 PM	#196
o_yohan1973 Join Date: May 2005 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Nice! Your spawn room kinda reminds me of what I was working on last year befor I stopped. http://img32.imageshack.us/my.php?im...ge200001by.jpg That was in this thread http://forums.fortress-forever.com/s...?t=2597&page=3 I like your lighting in it so far! Your exterior looks real good too! Good job!!!!!!! Edit: Skip the good job comment! It's freak'n awsome!!!!!! Dude You have SKILL!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Last edited by o_yohan1973; 09-07-2006 at 05:19 PM.

07-09-2006, 05:57 AM	#181
o_addicted to morphine Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: East Coast, USA Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	I've skimmed this entire thread, and I wanted to share a few thoughts I had about the visuals. From what I could tell from the screens, the mapping of the outside areas are really tight, really clean, and they have an amazing look to them. I feel like a sense of negative space is very important when it comes to how a map looks and feels ( I swear to god I'm not as full of it as it may seem from that last comment ) and I think you utilize negative space very well in your outdoor stages. I look at them, and I just see a freedom to conc and rj to my hearts content, and while attack maps get spammy, the outdoor areas give me the impression that with a good conc I could soar above all the conflag. I've never seen a screenshot that actually conjured dancing images of gameplay in my head before, so hey... that's a good sign, right? From what I've gathered, you haven't done a serious pass at the 2nd stage yet, but from that one screenshot I was a little scared. In contrast to the outdoor areas, your indoor areas seem dark and cramped. While variety helps, I feel like you could stand to blow it out with some more light, and make the areas larger in general. I feel like concing and rjing, just from that shot, would be severely limited. Since you need an elevator to reach the 3rd stage, I'm assuming the second is deep underground... but even so I'd love to see some roofs just ripped off to get some sunlight (and negative space) in there. Also, I enjoy the curviness of the windows and the towers in general, and so, in contrast, the 2nd shot you posted (on the first page) of the spawn point looks jagged, and ultra angled (especially the floor). On D, I can't wait to set up my SG on top of the little cliff next to the elevator, and on O, I can't wait to RJ from there to the cliff right above and annoy the defenders from behind. Anyway -- I think you've got great talent, and I really enjoy all your outdoor shots. I hope you see this map through to the end.

07-17-2006, 09:24 PM	#182
o_tyrus Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Not trying to be a sucker, but I think Nezumi is probably the best mapper here! All your maps are great looking so far. Can't wait to play them!

07-17-2006, 11:10 PM	#183
o_filter Join Date: Jul 2006 Location: Valencia, California Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Looks nice, cant wait to try it out

07-18-2006, 06:06 AM	#185
o_nezumi Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The Peoples Republic of Harmfull Free Radicals Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	YO SHUT UP CIRC DON'T MAKE ME COME IN THERE!! Hey, thanks for the comments guys. Morphine, yes the second part is cramped now, especially for an AvD map. I'm seriously reconsidering a lot of the parts I have built (although some are really cool) to make it less 'corridor' and more 'courtyard'. There's one awkward part now that has the attacking team riding up an elevator, but the elevators are kinda like well FR style things where you get on and they lift up, but there's no real way down but to jump. The offence has the option of completely ignoring this route and going around but this way looks way cooler so I'm going to see if I can do anything more intuitive with that room. And all of the second part is going to be brighter than that first screenshot I showed. Tbh I haven't worked on this map pretty much at all since the last screenshot. I've been in a kind of "sit around in a bathrobe drinking mountain dew all day" kinda mood recently. Bah! To hell with that. Spamming the forums can wait too. I'm gonna see if I can't get the second stage connected to the third tonight. starts arranging winamp playlist

07-18-2006, 07:19 AM	#186
o_addicted to morphine Join Date: Feb 2006 Location: East Coast, USA Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Well good luck with that, looking forward to progress and screenshots.

07-19-2006, 03:39 PM	#189
o_nezumi Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The Peoples Republic of Harmfull Free Radicals Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	puts on best villain voice Kyle Katarn!

08-21-2006, 07:57 PM	#190
o_nezumi Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The Peoples Republic of Harmfull Free Radicals Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	News: Cacti isn't dead. The middle section is almost finished. I can fairly confidently say that I've done a rought pass of the entire map except for the lighting in 2 rooms in the middle section. After that it's all tweaks baby. Of course, that's the tedious part but it shouldn't be too bad with this map. The middle section turned out to be quite a bit longer than I thought it would. It takes about 50 seconds to run (not bhop or anything) through it, whereas the first section takes 30 seconds and the 3rd takes 40 (although only 20 to run down, hehe). This means that the map is a bit longer than dustbowl, which was about 30 seconds for each section. The middle section may be way too easy to defend. It's all indoors so there's less opportunities for rocket/conc jumping, and there are a lot of choke points. If I position the grenades fairly close to the attackers, all the choke points should work in their favor though. There's also a lot of branching paths so the defenders are split, etc.... The good news too is that the map HASN'T run into any max_anything problems, runs smoothly throughout, I think, and is only 30 megs (without any files bsp-zipped). So this just might work out after all.

08-21-2006, 08:15 PM	#191
o_bumgravy Join Date: Dec 2005 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	When u say x secs to run, remember that classes in FF will be different speeds than in TFC. Have u considered that when timing the runs?

08-21-2006, 09:48 PM	#192
o_ma\|2io Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Detroit, MI Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Good. Some complain ADLers complain that, "All adl is now is if you have a good demo and sniper you win." Looks like cap 2 will eliminate some of that because of good ol' DM.

08-22-2006, 12:36 AM	#193
o_industrial Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Hey man I love this map especially the mountain part, but I have a few suggestions wich would make it a little more balanced towards the attacking team imho. The first thing youll notice is the ladder to the left, I think thats fair, nice thingy for spies to quickly mingle with the defence and start chopping etc :P The boxes would allow for _some_ defence as its 0 ATM The hole in building, well, sg! just my 2 cents

08-22-2006, 02:21 PM	#194
o_nezumi Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The Peoples Republic of Harmfull Free Radicals Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	I may put the ladder there just to make things more interesting. It'd offer the offence another way up, and it'd allow the defense a faster way down without taking damage. I think an SG in the hole you've drawn in that building would be out of range of most things and just get taken out from long range. If there indeed isn't enough cover in this area I could put some rock props where those boxes are pretty easily.

09-09-2006, 03:12 AM	#197
o_ma\|2io Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Detroit, MI Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	New screenies? Or did you go like, "too much work, im gonna pour some pop in my computer." then cry after losing your map.

09-09-2006, 04:36 AM	#198
o_nezumi Join Date: Mar 2005 Location: The Peoples Republic of Harmfull Free Radicals Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	What caused me to pour poop on my computer was almost having to move out of my apartment, and trying to find a job/sign up for classes. I'm gonna try to get some more screens out this weekend. I'm also kinda supposed to be making changes to a CS:S map of mine for CAL, but that just requires a recompile untill everyone finds something else about the map to whine about. Those people are picky (not that I can blame them). And now that we've seen the dustbowl textures, I have to say that they look like they will be satisfactory for cacti. So everyone imagine this map with the ff_dustbowl dust/rock textures untill they actually release them.

09-09-2006, 06:41 PM	#199
o_ma\|2io Join Date: Dec 2005 Location: Detroit, MI Posts Rated Helpful 0 Times	Pffft screw real life.

09-10-2006, 04:18 AM	#200
Lost Fear teh crowbar. Retired FF Staff Join Date: Jan 2005 Location: Oklahoma Gametype: CTF ftw, yeh Posts Rated Helpful 6 Times	Well, you have to screw in real life, cuz it don't really work virtually. Yet. __________________ Do what you want cuz a pirate is free! You are a pirate!

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