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Old 12-07-2014, 09:42 PM   #1
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Bring back my old jumppad

Devs,

Why are you making these weak ass jumppads? All my scout conc priming is timed perfectly taking into account the speed and distance of the OG jumppad.

This is bs
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Old 12-07-2014, 09:52 PM   #2
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Old 12-07-2014, 10:31 PM   #3
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What if I don't want to use my conc in conjunction with the jpad? An example of a run I do a lot on Destroy is priming a conc, use jpad at front of base to sliding off mid-bridge ledge, which sets me up for concing up security ramp and to the next floor up, to flagroom. Using the jpad WITH a conc basically just wastes a conc for me, making it much harder to escape the enemy base.

It was a big deal when discussing lowering acceleration from 14 because due to a concern that it wouldn't allow you to be able to circle jump from destroy's inside balcony to cap point, yet such a big change to the jpad is just accepted?

*does not compute*
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Old 12-07-2014, 10:40 PM   #4
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Make an argument for WHY light O needs that benefit, not how it's different.

What you listed Kube was the entire reasoning behind the change. The jpad added an unearned and exceptionally easy level of consistency to scout and medic.
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Old 12-08-2014, 12:58 AM   #5
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After most of you left, we did a little testing on Shutdown... from the middle of the map(where the tunnel is, on top), no class could make a jump via the jPad onto the deck level where the cap point/entry is.

Not only that, the heavier the class, the more damage you took slamming into the front of the base wall. Even if the main door was open, you still took damage when you landed.

Somehow, I doubt that was part of the intention.

Haven't tried all of the other maps to see what affects this change has... but an organized test might be in order.
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Old 12-08-2014, 02:24 AM   #6
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This type of complaint really bums me out.

Some relevant stuff:
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Old 12-08-2014, 12:38 PM   #7
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Is there a way to adjust it based on the class using it? That way, heavier/slower classes get a bigger boost, while lighter classes get less?
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Old 12-08-2014, 05:12 PM   #8
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IMO I'm perfectly fine with the reduced speed and height JPad.

The issue I have is that a standard conc provides 1200 horizontal speed, whereas a JPad conc provides ~1000 horizontal speed.
I'd suggest that the JPad conc limit should be somewhere between 1300 and 1400 horizontal speed (I don't think this is unreasonable given without the limits you can reach 1600), and that the pure JPad horizontal speed should be ~850 (so, still nerfed but slightly less than the current nerf).

Keep the current vertical speed though, I feel like it's better.

EDIT: Shoutout's to the auto-GitHub posting confusing me and making me think someone had posted on the forums when it was me posting on GitHub.
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Old 12-08-2014, 07:21 PM   #9
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What if the Jpad had 3 different options in height/distance to choose from? 1. shoots you high up and maybe not as far 2. shoots you straight(further/farther) but not as high 3. mixture of both?
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Old 12-08-2014, 08:35 PM   #10
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I guess my opinion is that right now, the jpad went from Too useful to Pretty much useless for scout. It's only marginally better than bunnyhopping in its current state and although I agree the speed needs to be decreased, I'd prefer if it were a bit faster. The majority of people using jump pads will be offensive based classes. In it's current state, since the scouts get hardly any boost, it will lower the incentive to build one, favoring an initial concussion grenade out of spawn instead.
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Old 12-08-2014, 09:21 PM   #11
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Kube, you are correct that this change will change things. That is the intention of making changes.

This is so incredibly reminiscent of the skim cap backlash in 2.1 beta.
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Old 12-08-2014, 09:26 PM   #12
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ddm999 View Post
The issue I have is that a standard conc provides 1200 horizontal speed, whereas a JPad conc provides ~1000 horizontal speed.
I'd suggest that the JPad conc limit should be somewhere between 1300 and 1400 horizontal speed (I don't think this is unreasonable given without the limits you can reach 1600),
The problem with a high jump pad + conc speed cap is that it doesn't address the following two problems:

Quote:
Originally Posted by squeek on Github
  • It allows for near complete consistency in runs that would otherwise be somewhat difficult/special (for example, rampsliding the FD lip on schtop/monkey)
  • It allows medics to pull off the above mentioned runs with the same exact consistency as scouts, even where it'd otherwise be impossible (medics wouldn't be able to achieve scout-level conc speeds without a jump pad).
There might be some magic value that makes the choice between using the conc + jump pad for consistency vs. using just a conc for speed interesting/deep, but I'm skeptical (consistency is a pretty nice thing to have). We'd also have to have separate caps for medics and scouts to address the second issue.

EDIT:
Quote:
Originally Posted by ddm999
Keep the current vertical speed though, I feel like it's better.
Vertical speed didn't change.
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Old 12-08-2014, 10:12 PM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KubeDawg View Post
I guess my opinion is that right now, the jpad went from Too useful to Pretty much useless for scout. It's only marginally better than bunnyhopping in its current state and although I agree the speed needs to be decreased, I'd prefer if it were a bit faster. The majority of people using jump pads will be offensive based classes. In it's current state, since the scouts get hardly any boost, it will lower the incentive to build one, favoring an initial concussion grenade out of spawn instead.
Good gravy man that's the whole point. Scouts need it the least, so they get the least benefit. It's a team tool, build it for your demo, soldier, and spy that are almost never absent from offense.
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Old 12-08-2014, 10:40 PM   #14
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Quote:
Originally Posted by squeek. View Post
EDIT:

Vertical speed didn't change.
Yeah, at some point a week or so ago my brain forgot that horizontal doesn't mean vertical in any way, shape or form so I've ended up talking a lot of crap over the past few days.
Worst thing is that it actually felt to me as if there was less vertical speed. Hey, I'm dumb.


The issue is probably that it's just a very big change that really invalidates the use of the JPad as it's currently used. (I'm really not used to priming a conc on spawn, so I end up being a second slower than with old JPad...)


I'd suggest some method of bunnyhopping over a JPad without triggering it (so a scout isn't effectively 'slowed' by using it when they want to conc and it isn't placed too far away from the fastest path). No idea how you'd do this, though.
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