+jump on Mwheelup and down

[Credge]

Pretty much what caesium said.

In TFC I had BHopping down well enough with space as my jump that I could, usually, not mess up on an O run. Of course, I played D so whenever I played O I was always "in the zone".

I tried doing this in FF when I started and found that it worked decently, but I was losing speed every jump when I landed. I tested this with timed jumps and found that going in a straight line (no BHopping... just running straight for a bit and then just jumping) that I lost speed until I reach 0. With queued jumping, you don't lose speed.

It's really best to just learn to queue your jumps.

[compact]

i had to register just to post this.

in here comes Jeroi with a completely legit question about why mwheeldown doesnt work like it does in tfc and you got assholes like this Credge bloke trying to make him out as being some kind of a retard that doesnt wanna get with the times and use space for jumping.

that brings me to this gem "quote" They don't. The only people that think that the mouse wheel is actually a good medium for jumping are TF players that couldn't get the BHop timing right and relied on it."unquote"

this statement is absolute bullshite to tell you the truth, nobody could "get the timing right" in tfc consistently and the only way to do so was to either use script or as i did and a lot of others was to use mwheeldown.

allow me to quote Credge again "quote" In TFC I had BHopping down well enough with space as my jump that I could, usually, not mess up on an O run. Of course, I played D so whenever I played O I was always "in the zone"."unquote"

in other words he couldnt bunnyhop at all but he liked to pretend he could.

ive gotten used to jump queuing with space its not like its hard but that doesnt mean i wouldnt switch back to mwheeldown if given the chance.

[Credge]

Originally Posted by compact

this statement is absolute bullshite to tell you the truth, nobody could "get the timing right" in tfc consistently and the only way to do so was to either use script or as i did and a lot of others was to use mwheeldown.

allow me to quote Credge again "quote" In TFC I had BHopping down well enough with space as my jump that I could, usually, not mess up on an O run. Of course, I played D so whenever I played O I was always "in the zone"."unquote"

in other words he couldnt bunnyhop at all but he liked to pretend he could.

ive gotten used to jump queuing with space its not like its hard but that doesnt mean i wouldnt switch back to mwheeldown if given the chance.

Cool.

I couldn't BHop at all in TFC? A right shame that is. It's also shame that no other FPS player on the planet has ever even though of using the mouse wheel to jump besides TFC players that couldn't cut it. Go ahead, ask yourself what games require any sort of jumping skill and you'll soon realize that only TF games. You'll also probably realize that, surprise surprise, TF was originally a Quake game. Oddly enough, Quake had queued jumping, much like FF does! It's weird how every other TF game past the original has had queued jumping and the only one that hasn't had it is TFC. And it's very odd that this kind of jumping only existed in TFC.

So, to say again, the only FPS players on the planet that ever used their mouse wheel to jump where TFC players that, to put it simply, couldn't time anything worth a crap. If you took enough offense to that to sign up and try to derail me, then you're the kind of person I'm talking about.

bind mwheeldown jump; wait; wait; wait; wait; wait; wait; wait

I'm sure that sounds really familiar to you.

P.S. Your logic sucks. But I'll just bold parts that don't add up.

allow me to quote Credge again "quote" In TFC I had BHopping down well enough with space as my jump that I could, usually, not mess up on an O run. Of course, I played D so whenever I played O I was always "in the zone"."unquote"

in other words he couldnt bunnyhop at all but he liked to pretend he could.

I sometimes wonder what goes through someones head when they read and write things on the internet.

[compact]

It's also shame that no other FPS player on the planet has ever even though of using the mouse wheel to jump besides TFC players that couldn't cut it.

what do you mean by "couldnt cut it"
i know for a fact that anyone half decent at tfc bunnyhopping had to use mwheeldown or a script to bh properly that doesnt mean they cant use jump queing in other games just that is was impossible to do so in tfc.

and err what difference does it make tf was originally a quake game who cares?
were talking about tfc here and ff neither of those are quake games. with both tfc and ff games being based on hl1/hl2 engine i dont see what the problem is with ff supporting mwheeldown unless theres some sort of engine limitation.

what do i know you could be the greatest space only no script bh'er ever to grace tfc.

and a simple bind mwheeldown +jump did just fine.

[caesium]

yeah, compact, i completely agree with you, but there's no point even attempting to combat the abundant ignorance on the FF forums, so i figure best to just join in with it and make a little banter to keep you sane. this "mwheel for bhop" question has been asked so many times and i cba answering posts in detail and entire sincerity about it anymore. i just want everyone to be on a fair and level playing field, so i keep trying to let ppl know that in FF it's advantageous to use a button for bhop if you can get used to it for those who rly can't adjust, the only way to get perfect bhop with the mousewheel is a [modified lol] version of the script i posted on the last page.

[Desyphur]

Originally Posted by caesium

lol, how are these debates still going on?...

jeroi, leaving aside the gross ignorance in some of your statements, here's a special toggle bhop script for you if you can't cope with learning a new bhop btn:

alias omgisucklol "+jump;say OUTA MY WAY HERE CUM TEH PROE HUNNYBOP"
alias icantlearnanewbtn "-jump;say NOBODY PANIC THE SPEEDYLOL IS DEACTIVATE"
bind mwheeldown omgisucklol
bind mwheelup icantlearnanewbtn

btw Garland-W, yes sticking jump on the wheel will work, but it's rly not ideal (you'll not get perfect jumping). so yeah, my advice to anyone who wants to play FF at all seriously is just bind jump to a BUTTON and get used to it. it's really very simple.

Hahhahahaha

[KubeDawg]

In TFC, the mousewheel was used primarily for the reasons listed by previous posters, but some still used it regardless of their skill.

Instead of bashing him and telling him the only reason it was used was to assist in bhopping, why not offer some constructive suggestions. The amount of sarcasm and passive agressive comments in this thread are astronomical.

Yes, he did call it a bug, but does that mean you have to act like a fucking child and treat him like he's mentally retarded or something?

"Logic" has nothing to do with his issue. He played TFC a certain way, and what he's asked for probably cannot be done, except for maybe a workaround, but if that was discussed from the beginning without all the bullshit, this thread wouldn't have made it to the 2nd page and probably would've been resolved by now.

[Iggy]

I have found it easiest(to me) to use the wheel as a button(push it, it is a 3rd button, or 4th, or whatever). The only time I have trouble with that, is if I hit it just off center, and scroll the wheel, which is weapon select.

[Garland-W]

So if I scroll the mousewheel just before I land and am still scrolling it as I land why wouldn't this queue jump if holding space does?

[Circuitous]

Jump Queueing: Permanent +jump.
Mousewheel: +jump -jump +jump -jump +jump -jump +jump -jump +jump -jump

Basically, using mousewheel your odds of having -jump on at the "perfect" jump time is 50%.

That, plus spammed +commands tend to get confused, means your odds of a proper jump are far worse than queueing, which is perfect every time.

[Hawk Eye]

So, to say again, the only FPS players on the planet that ever used their mouse wheel to jump where TFC players that, to put it simply, couldn't time anything worth a crap.

Sourceforts scroll jumping. You could reach great heights by spamming jump on a ramp- allowing you to breach an enemy wall. It was originally a bug, but quickly became widely known and used all over the place.

Maybe we could add an option in the Fortress Options for people who do not wish to relearn to bhop, which disables jump queuing? Or is this server-side [likely, methinks]?

It would put them at a great disadvantage, but at least they could maintain their old ways?

[Circuitous]

It's not serverside, it's hard-coded.

[Credge]

Originally Posted by KubeDawg

Instead of bashing him and telling him the only reason it was used was to assist in bhopping, why not offer some constructive suggestions. The amount of sarcasm and passive agressive comments in this thread are astronomical.

It's been said many, many times that the absolute best thing you can do is to 'relearn' BHopping. There isn't any relearning though. Instead of spinning a wheel, you hold a button down. There comes a point where you have to say "No, this is a new game, learn it how it's meant to be done if you want to be efficient." I did it. You did it. We've all done it.

It's absolutely no different than going to TF2 and complaining that BHop doesn't exist. >It does<, it's just not efficient to do so. You can still use your mouse wheel to BHop in FF, it just isn't efficient. This has been said over, and over, and over, and over, and over, and over again in so many threads that it borders on redundant.

In related news, you can use your MWheel up and down to cancel states. Bind your mwheel down to +jump and bind your mwheel up to -jump. Closest to it you can get while remaining efficient.

And yes, using your mouse wheel for BHopping in TFC was a crutch. It doesn't matter how you try to word it. "EVERYBODY WAS DOING IT!" Yeah, and a lot of people weren't as good as they thought they were.

[caesium]

ok, let's make things simple for anyone wondering what their options are:

1. if you can get used to using an actual button for jump rather than the mouse scroller then do so, it's better (100% perfect jumps).

2. yes, you can just bind +jump to mwheeldown and it works, but it's not ideal cos it's slower.

3. if you really want to stick with the mouse scroller for bhop then there are a few things you can do to increase the probability of doing perfect jumps. two obvious ones:

• use the script i posted above (mwheeldown toggles jump on, mwheelup toggles jump off). this gives 100% perfect jumps. this was a completely srs suggestion btw - did anyone actually try it?

• use the following script to make each scroll of the mwheel hold jump on for a specified time. this will greatly increase the probability of a perfect jump relative to using just +jump, but it's not 100% as you get with a simple button:

waitsometime "wait;wait;wait" // see below
alias bhop "+jump;unbind mwheeldown;waitsometime;-jump;bind mwheeldown bhop"
bind mwheeldown bhop

adjust number of waits: more waits means higher probability of perfect jump, but it'll jump for longer even after you stop scrolling (so too many will be v ghey). the 3 waits i put in atm is just a complete guess - i haven't tested it at all.

[Jester]

http://forums.fortress-forever.com/s...ad.php?t=17307
FTW

[Garland-W]

And if you scroll the mwheel only one notch will that still trigger the "-jump"?
So if you use the command +jump and then use the command +jump twice again before you land the second of the +jump commands will turn into a "-jump"?

[Paft]

Unless you play both TFC and FF, switching between the two games a lot then one shouldn't really give a toss since it won't take too long to adapt the difference. But if like me you do that's the only pooh thing but meh, I just have to deal with it. If you don't then fuck the mousewheel off, get wep switch back on that and get the jump que on a button baby.

[Jeroi]

Originally Posted by compact

ive gotten used to jump queuing with space its not like its hard but that doesnt mean i wouldnt switch back to mwheeldown if given the chance.

This exactly the point what I was trying to say. I can adapt the space or mouseX. But Mwheeldown/up is the BETTER way and also more SOUNDLESS, as you wil hit a MANY TIMES the button which makes A LOT of noise but scroller dosent make anykind of noise what so ever.

Originally Posted by Credge

So, to say again, the only FPS players on the planet that ever used their mouse wheel to jump where TFC players that, to put it simply, couldn't time anything worth a crap. If you took enough offense to that to sign up and try to derail me, then you're the kind of person I'm talking about.

1. FF is TFC sequel, or atleast gameplay is exatcly same, maps are same, almoust gfx is the same also, but more detail and makers are OLD TFC players.

2. Maybe TFC did give the MouseWHEEL by a chance for players to realize how good the button is? Other games dosent understand it's potential.


Hard coded:

if {$buttonjump == true) halt;
else {

while ($jump == +jump) {
If ($landing == true) {
$jump = -jump;
$buttonjump = false;
}
}
}

Now jump queve accepts only one jump per time with ANY BUTTON.

This can be adapted to anykind of hard coding, changing the method for C++ and JAVA and use the hard coded way to implemend this.

[KubeDawg]

Originally Posted by Credge

It's been said many, many times that the absolute best thing you can do is to 'relearn' BHopping. There isn't any relearning though. Instead of spinning a wheel, you hold a button down. There comes a point where you have to say "No, this is a new game, learn it how it's meant to be done if you want to be efficient." I did it. You did it. We've all done it.

It's absolutely no different than going to TF2 and complaining that BHop doesn't exist. >It does<, it's just not efficient to do so. You can still use your mouse wheel to BHop in FF, it just isn't efficient. This has been said over, and over, and over, and over, and over, and over again in so many threads that it borders on redundant.

In related news, you can use your MWheel up and down to cancel states. Bind your mwheel down to +jump and bind your mwheel up to -jump. Closest to it you can get while remaining efficient.

And yes, using your mouse wheel for BHopping in TFC was a crutch. It doesn't matter how you try to word it. "EVERYBODY WAS DOING IT!" Yeah, and a lot of people weren't as good as they thought they were.

What, you can't tell he's new to these forums? Yeah, it gets repetitive telling people something works a certain way, but the constant flux of new people should tell you that ya need to treat everyone you don't know as someone who hasn't already heard this shit 1000 times. It's like working a job at a call center, where you fix the saaaame issue 50 times in 1 day. By then, you know the in's and outs of the issue, even found quicker ways to fix it, but every time a new customer calls, it's their First time dealing with that issue usually. So treat it like it's a fresh issue, not some stale and moldy cookie that nobody wants to touch.

[Credge]

Originally Posted by KubeDawg

What, you can't tell he's new to these forums? Yeah, it gets repetitive telling people something works a certain way, but the constant flux of new people should tell you that ya need to treat everyone you don't know as someone who hasn't already heard this shit 1000 times. It's like working a job at a call center, where you fix the saaaame issue 50 times in 1 day. By then, you know the in's and outs of the issue, even found quicker ways to fix it, but every time a new customer calls, it's their First time dealing with that issue usually. So treat it like it's a fresh issue, not some stale and moldy cookie that nobody wants to touch.

He's asked about it in the Euro pickup channel and was told the same thing.