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Old 09-19-2007, 09:43 AM   #201
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper
TF2 is not slow at all..... it's awesome the way it is and the player numbers tell you the same thing so far for a beta. And imo i think the respawn timer is good for this game.
I'd say the player numbers are a direct factor of the enormous advertising and marketing campaign TF2 had
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Old 09-19-2007, 09:49 AM   #202
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TF2 is taking fortress away from TF and CTF, and towards games like DoD and CS. Fun game, but a better title would be Counter-Fortress.

I don't feel this way because it's not like TFC, but because it's not like TF, TFC, ETF, Q3TF, UF, or any other fortress mod ever released. TF2 is a fun game but it doesn't come with what you would expect from a fortress game: CTF, depth, and fast-placed high-flying action.
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Old 09-19-2007, 09:50 AM   #203
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Quote:
Originally Posted by willardjuice
The vast majority would say otherwise.

FF is already dead and soon will be passed by TFC in number of players.

"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."
- Mark Twain

You are comparing the release of a mod that was put together by unpaid volunteers - high school students, college student, working stiffs - to a title put out by a AAA company. Valve has a large TEAM of employees. They have massive marketing and can promote through STEAM. Of course they have and will have a massive audience. Comparing the numbers between FF and TF2 is silly.

The FF team completed their vision of TF in 1/2 the time, with volunteers and in my opinion, produced a game with more depth.

THAT is impressive.
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Old 09-19-2007, 09:57 AM   #204
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Not having a dig, but I will be interested to see if those saying how great TF2 is now will still be playing in 2 or 3 weeks time.
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Old 09-19-2007, 11:30 AM   #205
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DarthGreg
TF2 is taking fortress away from TF and CTF, and towards games like DoD and CS. Fun game, but a better title would be Counter-Fortress.
I call it Team Cartoon, it's not TF without grenades and infection.


Quote:
Originally Posted by Viper
You know whats funny? this is the ONLY forum ive read people saying TF2 isnt good or isnt TFC or whatever.
There are plenty of people complaining about it on the Steam User Forums too.
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Old 09-19-2007, 11:36 AM   #206
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To those bitching about TF2's "bugs" and crash issues: I would like to remind you that TF2 is currently still in BETA! This is not the finished product.
 


Old 09-19-2007, 11:38 AM   #207
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It seems all the tf2 people have migrated over here to try and put us down lol
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Old 09-19-2007, 11:45 AM   #208
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Krylon
TF2 is almost like the "Wii game" for PC
hey man, nintendo games are really deep!
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Old 09-19-2007, 11:47 AM   #209
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It's shit, cant wait for Portal now though
 


Old 09-19-2007, 11:55 AM   #210
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I'll add my 0.02 for what it's worth.

I really enjoyed it, it's fun there are new depths and strategies to explore and I enjoyed the maps I've played on.

I totally think ff and tf2 can co exist, one offering a (arguably)deeper and more "classic" TF while TF2 offers this new and imo fun thing. Long live the fortress brothers, so different and yet I'm glad they're both around
 


Old 09-19-2007, 12:00 PM   #211
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Sureshot
The changes that have been made between the classes in TFC and the classes in TF2 are hardly revolutionary. How are they so much more unique? Some classes have actually become LESS unique, such as the Engy being unable to give armour to people due to it being removed, and the fact that class-specific grenades have been taken out of the game has resulted in less diversity. No class has gone overgone a major overhaul, apart from the Medic I'd say, and in my mind, there is actually less differentiation than in previous incarnations.
Seriously...you need to go back and reread your debate with Bob. He was not saying TF2 revoluntionized the classes. He was saying the classes in a team fortress game are much more unique than the "classes" found in other games.

Most of the time in other games the classes means you get to carry a different type of machine gun and maybe dish out health packs or ammo packs. Of course there are other differences but they usually aren't too great and the characteristics of the "base" player itself stay the same between classes. In Team Fortress (and I'm talking the defining aspect of the game, not a specific version of it) the classes are much more varried and unique.

I happen to agree with Bob and think a lot of people have lost focus on what TF really is. Concs and bunnyhopping are not requirements for TF. The unique class based gameplay is though.

With that said I understand that there are people out there who do not like TF2 for whatever reason. That's fine. That's your opinion and you are entitled to it. Just don't sit here and spam crap about how TF2 isn't a TF game because it doesn't have concs and some of the other things I have been reading over the past couple days (not replying to SS here).
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Old 09-19-2007, 12:00 PM   #212
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Quote:
Originally Posted by summit
A pace isn't the definitive aspect of any game, sorry. And if it is, it mustn't have been much of a game to start with.
ok, lets look at it from a non source perspective: lets slow down the pace of the quake and UT series of games, and add respawn timers. see what happens?
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Old 09-19-2007, 12:21 PM   #213
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Originally Posted by mervaka
ok, lets look at it from a non source perspective: lets slow down the pace of the quake and UT series of games, and add respawn timers. see what happens?
I agree, this would change the game. But it wouldn't *break* the game. Isn't this what the argument's been about the entire time? No one would start complaining "THIS ISN'T UT/QUAKE!!!".

Let me offer my own example: MoHAA Spearhead compared to MOH Airborne. Pace in both is completely different - in fact the changes made in MoHA, compared to SH, severely outweigh the changes made to TF2 compared to TFC. Try being a fan and given Pacific Assault that's supposed to "cut-it" - at least VALVe support the games they make.

In any case, a game is comprised of multiple features working together - if they work together with cohesively, isn't that the mark of a good game? Sounds like a lot of people are trying to use TFC as their definition of what a TF game should be like, and whilst I understand the huge gap between games makes this assumption understandable, it doesn't necessarily make it correct.

edit: and sorry, I think people may have misinterpreted what I said - there should have been greater emphasis on "the" when I said it's not the definitive aspect of any game.
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Old 09-19-2007, 12:50 PM   #214
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It's slower, I'm not trying to argue it isn't; but that doesn't mean it isn't a "TF" game
No harm but it sounds like your involvement in TF games has only just started. The whole ethos behind the fortress style games was fast paced non stop action - thats probably a paraphrase of Valves own blurb about TFC. So when you take the fast pace and the non stop out of it what have you left ? Oh action......slow......drawn out action, just like any other FPS out there really....

TF2 is a decent game, it stands well on it's own and looks great, but it is most definitely not a fortress style game as it is missing 2 of the 3 key elements that defined the fortress series gameplay.
 


Old 09-19-2007, 12:55 PM   #215
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Quote:
Originally Posted by summit
I agree, this would change the game. But it wouldn't *break* the game. Isn't this what the argument's been about the entire time? No one would start complaining "THIS ISN'T UT/QUAKE!!!".
i couldnt disagree more. that would entirely break the game.
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Old 09-19-2007, 01:02 PM   #216
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should have called it day of defeat fortress
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Old 09-19-2007, 01:02 PM   #217
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Quote:
Originally Posted by 4est
"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies and statistics."
- Mark Twain

You are comparing the release of a mod that was put together by unpaid volunteers - high school students, college student, working stiffs - to a title put out by a AAA company. Valve has a large TEAM of employees. They have massive marketing and can promote through STEAM. Of course they have and will have a massive audience. Comparing the numbers between FF and TF2 is silly.

The FF team completed their vision of TF in 1/2 the time, with volunteers and in my opinion, produced a game with more depth.

THAT is impressive.
That's all fine and great but what does that have to do with FF being a dead mod and having less players than TFC?
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Old 09-19-2007, 01:03 PM   #218
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The original UT was a much slower game than the series is today
 


Old 09-19-2007, 01:06 PM   #219
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lmao just seen mrbeefy post this in the tf2 thread in phl
http://www.dylanmessaging.com/messag...298M-9C3O-7797
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Old 09-19-2007, 01:16 PM   #220
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Quote:
Originally Posted by EngeeMan
That's all fine and great but what does that have to do with FF being a dead mod and having less players than TFC?
troll.
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