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Old 09-06-2008, 02:38 AM   #1
Nuk3m
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Stop Cock Blocking

Banned 10080 minutes.
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Old 09-06-2008, 03:49 AM   #2
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This isn't the best way to keep your word.
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Old 09-06-2008, 04:08 AM   #3
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?
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Old 09-06-2008, 12:03 PM   #4
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Nuk3m is on his "second chance" after a previous perm ban for language. We lifted it per his request and he promised to keep it clean and even offered to report offenders of our rules. He's in debt to me (his words, not mine), which I have not yet cashed in, and gave me his word.

BTW Nuk3m, as you know, temp bans for language are exponential. The next one's a doosy.

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Old 09-06-2008, 01:32 PM   #5
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You can tell from the chat logs I wasn't talking lol... I wasn't thinking when I typed it, I found out after. "WHOOPS!"

It was the 3 engi defense on aardvark, that I was refering to.
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Old 09-06-2008, 02:11 PM   #6
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Thats only 7 days.
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Old 09-06-2008, 02:35 PM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuk3m
You can tell from the chat logs I wasn't talking lol... I wasn't thinking when I typed it, I found out after. "WHOOPS!"
Can someone translate this for me?
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Old 09-06-2008, 02:41 PM   #8
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He's trying to say he was pissed about the three sg defense in a public server.
Standard reply for most people "Stop Cock Blocking".
What he wanted to say "the three sg defense is really lame could one of you change class? so the O can do something?"
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Old 09-06-2008, 09:26 PM   #9
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Quote:
Originally Posted by [AE] 82694
He's trying to say he was pissed about the three sg defense in a public server.
Standard reply for most people "Stop Cock Blocking".
What he wanted to say "the three sg defense is really lame could one of you change class? so the O can do something?"
yeah, I wasnt thinking so I got in trouble. im not asking for an unban. I was thinking maybe to suggest, a two strikes your out instead of a one strike your out, cause i didnt realize until i got the ban notice. sounds crazy, but I forgot about the swear filter cause i wasnt thinking of what server i was in. If u put it like it was before, where it doesnt echo to everyone, instead u get a warning, that would be cool. something like

[Scuzz Tools] Do not curse next offense will ban you.
[Scuzz Tools] You will be banned next time you curse.

idk, just trying to help you guys. If a tree falls in the woods do you hear it? thats why I think having some kind of notice like THIS SERVER IS LANGUAGE PROTECTED NEXT OFFENSE WILL RESULT IN A BAN.
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Old 09-06-2008, 09:55 PM   #10
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cock is a bad word now ? eh?!?!

But I love my cock
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Old 09-06-2008, 10:24 PM   #11
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Nuk3m
yeah, I wasnt thinking so I got in trouble. im not asking for an unban. I was thinking maybe to suggest, a two strikes your out instead of a one strike your out, cause i didnt realize until i got the ban notice. sounds crazy, but I forgot about the swear filter cause i wasnt thinking of what server i was in. If u put it like it was before, where it doesnt echo to everyone, instead u get a warning, that would be cool. something like

[Scuzz Tools] Do not curse next offense will ban you.
[Scuzz Tools] You will be banned next time you curse.

idk, just trying to help you guys. If a tree falls in the woods do you hear it? thats why I think having some kind of notice like THIS SERVER IS LANGUAGE PROTECTED NEXT OFFENSE WILL RESULT IN A BAN.
Everyone gets chances before they push it to a ban. After a ban it gets progressively long. However... I like one aspect of your idea, I may put in a timed warning for those in that position.

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Old 09-07-2008, 01:16 AM   #12
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Stop breaking simple rules.

Or, stop saying curse words you think you won't get punished for saying.
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Old 09-07-2008, 01:34 AM   #13
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If possible, I suggest a message when joining along the lines of "Welcome to the OT server, please obey the rules and watch your language. You have x infractions until you are temporarily banned."

Also, a periodic "You are playing on the OT server, please obey the rules and watch your language." message would help as well.
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Old 09-07-2008, 01:59 AM   #14
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Whatever happened to simple censores and gags? A ban for words? Seriously? I know I never say anything on this stuff, but holy shit. Servers can completely control what words are seen, so banning seems like a last resort for getting rid of actual problems. Cursing can be completely avoided, but griefing and cheating can't.

"Bob: this is fucking stupid" -> "Bob: this is ****ing stupid"

Bob keeps playing. FF keeps players. Problem is solved.

However...

"Bob: this is fucking stupid" -> Bob banned

Bob stops playing. FF loses players. Problem is worse.

I'm way late to these arguments, I guess.
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Old 09-07-2008, 02:24 AM   #15
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trepid_jon
Whatever happened to simple censores and gags? A ban for words? Seriously? I know I never say anything on this stuff, but holy shit. Servers can completely control what words are seen, so banning seems like a last resort for getting rid of actual problems. Cursing can be completely avoided, but griefing and cheating can't.

"Bob: this is fucking stupid" -> "Bob: this is ****ing stupid"

Bob keeps playing. FF keeps players. Problem is solved.

However...

"Bob: this is fucking stupid" -> Bob banned

Bob stops playing. FF loses players. Problem is worse.

I'm way late to these arguments, I guess.
THANK YOU! FINALLY! SOMEONE GETS IT!
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Old 09-07-2008, 03:59 AM   #16
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trepid_jon
Whatever happened to simple censores and gags? A ban for words? Seriously? I know I never say anything on this stuff, but holy shit. Servers can completely control what words are seen, so banning seems like a last resort for getting rid of actual problems. Cursing can be completely avoided, but griefing and cheating can't.

"Bob: this is fucking stupid" -> "Bob: this is ****ing stupid"

Bob keeps playing. FF keeps players. Problem is solved.

However...

"Bob: this is fucking stupid" -> Bob banned

Bob stops playing. FF loses players. Problem is worse.

I'm way late to these arguments, I guess.
cry me a fucking river
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Old 09-07-2008, 06:17 AM   #17
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They were warn and they kept on doing so they deserved it
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Old 09-07-2008, 11:39 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The Drizzle
cry me a fucking river
The Drizzle banned.

On a serious note, I don't recall ever seeing a ban for language in TFC. If you did swear the message wouldn't display and you got a warning, next time gag. If the infractor continued swearing he would get Llama'd...
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Old 09-07-2008, 12:33 PM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by theqwert125
If possible, I suggest a message when joining along the lines of "Welcome to the OT server, please obey the rules and watch your language.
Up to this point it already happens. It's in the motd (which is useless in FF), in regular advertisement messages. The system also tells an individual via being slayed and via a sound to please watch their language and content and warms that that temp or perm bans are given to those that do not.

Quote:
Originally Posted by theqwert125
You have x infractions until you are temporarily banned."
We used to do this and found people would intentionally push the limit. However, I think for people in Nuk3m's situation we may do something like this.

Quote:
Originally Posted by theqwert125
Also, a periodic "You are playing on the OT server, please obey the rules and watch your language." message would help as well.
Yep, this already happens.
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Old 09-07-2008, 12:59 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by trepid_jon
Whatever happened to simple censores and gags? A ban for words? Seriously? I know I never say anything on this stuff, but holy shit. Servers can completely control what words are seen, so banning seems like a last resort for getting rid of actual problems. Cursing can be completely avoided, but griefing and cheating can't.

"Bob: this is fucking stupid" -> "Bob: this is ****ing stupid"

Bob keeps playing. FF keeps players. Problem is solved.

However...

"Bob: this is fucking stupid" -> Bob banned
I think you misunderstand how the system works, because the situation you're outlining above is not the case. I'll explain.

1) Bob: this is fucking stupid.
- Bob is slayed to get his attention.
- Bob gets a text message that says "You were was slayed for language. Continued issues can result in a short or perm ban. See the Motd for more information.
- Bob has the following sound that is played over his machine that says, "Please keep the language and content clean. Continued language issues can result in a temporary of even permanent ban."
Bob now has a choice. He can intentionally push the system until he's perm banned, which is exactly what Nuk3m did, or he can go back to playing. A person is given several chances and has all three things above happen every single time to make sure they understand the server rules.

Now, after Bob does get banned temporarily, the system feels he's got a pretty clear idea of what the rules are. So, after that, each occurrance is a progressively longer ban.

So, you can see, it's not a case of "swear and instantly get banned." I suspect you know this though, we've been in the TFC/FF community for years and this is a long standing problem some individuals have with our server. Each time we do explain the system throughly, how it works is also available in our FAQ.

Why progressively longer? In the past we'd just ban individuals perm for language issues. In the past we NEVER reviewed bans, once you were gone you were gone. To help your community we've adjusted those policies while still filtering out unwanted players, but giving them more chances to play.

Now, Nuk3m is one of those rare cases that had his perm ban reviewed and lifted. He is still bound by the rules of the system and he's agreed to that.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trepid_jon
Whatever happened to simple censores and gags?
Two reasons. 1) In order to do that our language system would have to be coded into SourceMod. The system is far to complicated to handle that level of complexity without a performance hit to the playerbase. 2) We have found that individuals who intentionally push our rules or can not control their language are not people we want to play with. They have a tendency to be much more immature then other players, have difficulty handling the stress of the game, and are just not individuals we're interested in playing with long term. We only have 22 slots, so weeding out the people we don't want to play with and keeping the regulars we do is our primary concern.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trepid_jon
Bob stops playing. FF loses players. Problem is worse.
I'm way late to these arguments, I guess.
Any individual who discontinues playing a game because one server banned him wasn't interested in the game in the first place. Second, one thing that would truely help players understand a server's rules would be a fullpage motd message just like is present in TF2. I know you have a direct impact on making this happen and I am sure it would help many server administrators to see this happen.
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